Where is the outrage?

[mvscal]

That is your opinion and a particularly stupid one considering that it would make not one fucking iota of difference in the Sandy Hook situation or any other mass shooting.

and you know this how?

Because I know how long it takes to change a mag. What difference does it make if it takes a couple seconds longer to blast little Scooter cowering in the corner?

once again, educate me as to what the practical purpose of 30 or 100 round magazines for a civilian semi-automatic rifle or a 20 to 30 round magazine for a civilian handgun is?

Self defense against an armed intruder or assailant. Is that "practical" enough for you?

Now fuck off, idiot.

[smackaholic]

That is your opinion and a particularly stupid one considering that it would make not one fucking iota of difference in the Sandy Hook situation or any other mass shooting.

and you know this how? you might be right, but then again, maybe not....but that wasn't really the question I asked was it?

once again, educate me as to what the practical purpose of 30 or 100 round magazines for a civilian semi-automatic rifle or a 20 to 30 round magazine for a civilian handgun is?

Felix, you do know the Sandy Hook shooter put in a fresh magazine every time he entered a different room, right? You knew that he didn't use more than 12 rounds from any of his 30 round magazines, right? Of course you didn't, you're a dipshit.

and what's your point? if he'd had only 5 round magazines, would it have made a difference? maybe not, but maybe it would have.....but go ahead and take your best shot at it....what practical purpose do high capacity magazines for civilian weapons have?

I'm of the opinion that semi-auto rifle mags should be limited to 5 rounds, and handguns to a 10 round maximum.....

but don't worry as long as the NRA is on the job, the chances of ever getting any type of effective gun legislation passed into law is virtually non-existent

Why 10? Did you do some sort of fukking scientific study to determine this to be a good number?

No, of course not. You are merely spouting the party line of your massahs.

The standard load for most semi-auto handguns today is 15-17. What is the point of limiting this to an arbitrary lower number that turns many law abiding gun owners into felons? As for why more than 10 is good, not all of us are Annie Oakley. If shitgoes sideways ('sup derron?) we might not be terribly thrifty with our shooting. These cops, professionals who shoot regularly were unloading entire mags at these assbags, because that is sorta how gunfights go sometimes. So, if I am in that position someday and get kilt in the middle of reloading after emptying my 10 round mag, I am gong to haunt you.

As for those helpless kids in Sandy Hook, they are would have gotten just as dead had he used 7 round mags or a ballpeen hammer for that matter.

[Felix]

Self defense against an armed intruder or assailant. Is that "practical" enough for you?

dude, if you haven't capped an armed assailant within the first five shots, you're gonna get greased

[Truman]

once again, educate me as to what the practical purpose of 30 or 100 round magazines for a civilian semi-automatic rifle or a 20 to 30 round magazine for a civilian handgun is?

Oh, I dunno... Perhaps because most folks would prefer the convenience of emptying a hundred-round drum into your stupid ass rather than suffering through 20 magazine changes just to prove the same point?

[Derron]

Self defense against an armed intruder or assailant. Is that "practical" enough for you?

dude, if you haven't capped an armed assailant within the first five shots, you're gonna get greased

Sure..because in those tactical situations, you going to have the time, positioning, and ability to put your first 5 rounds on target effectively. Possibly, but unlikely.

[mvscal]

Self defense against an armed intruder or assailant. Is that "practical" enough for you?

dude, if you haven't capped an armed assailant within the first five shots, you're gonna get greased

That statement goes beyond total bullshit, straight through utterly asinine and lodges in comical stupidity. Did you read that on Daily KOS or something?

[Diego in Seattle]

Self defense against an armed intruder or assailant. Is that "practical" enough for you?

dude, if you haven't capped an armed assailant within the first five shots, you're gonna get greased

Sure..because in those tactical situations, you going to have the time, positioning, and ability to put your first 5 rounds on target effectively. Possibly, but unlikely.

What's the average distance in a gunfight?

[Felix]

yeah, the fact that you think a semi automatic rifle would be an effective self defense weapon in the middle of the night, in a darkened house, more than likely after being woken up is about as laughable as it gets.....most high capacity assault type rifles produce significant recoil, noise and muzzle flash that would probably leave the home owner deaf, blind, and likely pointed in the wrong direction.....

you need both hands to operate a semi auto rifle, so utilizing a flash light is out of the question....the best choice for most people would be a handgun, revolvers are more reliable, but with a quality gun and quality ammunition, a semi auto is an excellent choice, 9mm at the least, preferably a .40 caliber.....I don't use cheap ammunition and I've never had a bullet jamb in any of my handguns.....

remember bud, not everybody is as proficient with semi auto rifles as you apparently believe you are....

[mvscal]

yeah, the fact that you think a semi automatic rifle would be an effective self defense weapon in the middle of the night, in a darkened house, more than likely after being woken up is about as laughable as it gets..........

Yeah, right. I guess that's why the military uses revolvers in close quarters situations. Oh, wait a minute...they don't. The tactical carbine is the weapon of choice for any close quarters situation.

most high capacity assault type rifles produce significant recoil, noise and muzzle flash that would probably leave the home owner deaf, blind, and likely pointed in the wrong direction

Did you also read that on Daily KOS? Seriously, where are getting this shit from? I've fired a number of different "high capacity assault rifles" (whatever that's supposed to mean) and none of them produce any of those effects.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

...most high capacity assault type rifles produce significant recoil...

5.56 is NOT "significant recoil"...unless you are a supreme weakling.

...so utilizing a flash light is out of the question...

A flashlight is a stupid idea. Assuming you know the layout of your own property, even in the dark, telegraphing "Hey! Here I am!" to an armed intruder is retarded.

[mvscal]

you need both hands to operate a semi auto rifle, so utilizing a flash light is out of the question.....

...or maybe not. There are only dozens of different types to choose from. You really don't know what the fuck you're talking about, do you?

[BSmack]

Did you also read that on Daily KOS? Seriously, where are getting this shit from? I've fired a number of different "high capacity assault rifles" (whatever that's supposed to mean) and none of them produce any of those effects.

Seems to me that if I wanted to mass produce and sell a gun to as many people as possible, I would engineer it to reduce recoil, muzzle flash and noise.

[mvscal]

Seems to me that if I wanted to mass produce and sell a gun to as many people as possible, I would engineer it to reduce recoil, muzzle flash and noise.

It's called an AR-15 or any other PDW for that matter.

[Felix]

Yeah, right. I guess that's why the military uses revolvers in close quarters situations. Oh, wait a minute...they don't. The tactical carbine is the weapon of choice for any close quarters situation.

yes, fully trained military assault personnel on high alert walking into what they know could be a life and death situation are fully capable of wielding assault weapons very effectively.....joe fucking schmoe, who just got woken up in the middle of the night and who's sum total of training consists of shooting targets or varmints doesn't have quite the same skill set.....

Did you also read that on Daily KOS? Seriously, where are getting this shit from? I've fired a number of different "high capacity assault rifles" (whatever that's supposed to mean) and none of them produce any of those effects.

you're saying that a round fired from an AR-15 style weapon produces no muzzle flash and no sound? well, lets take a look



now that was a .223 fired during the daylight and the muzzle flash was pretty obvious, what do you suppose it would look like in a darkened house in the middle of the night....and why is she wearing that protective hearing gear if they're not all that loud....look bud, you're not talking to some fucking mook, you're talking to somebody that has worked around guns and has owned guns most of my life

or are you saying that most semiauto rifle owners have flash suppressors and sound suppressors?
lemme see, a flash suppressor will run you a couple of hundred bucks for a decent one, but a sound suppressor will be about a $1,200 to $1,400 add....now throw in the two to three hundred for a decent flashlight/laser mount, and we're talking about a pretty fucking expensive semi auto rifle for shooting varmints and such......

when I say high capacity I'm simply referring to semi auto rifles that utilize high capacity magazines....but you knew that

I'll wager I've shot significantly more variations of weapons than you have.....when you work in a gun store, that's one of the benefits.....you get to try out virtually every caliber of weapon by a wide variety of manufacturers from around the world.....travel to trade shows and get to fire full auto weapons....have you ever fired a full auto soviet made AK? ever fired a HK33? Ever fire a Sig SG540? I've shot those and lots of others.....

[mvscal]

joe fucking schmoe, who just got woken up in the middle of the night and who's sum total of training consists of shooting targets or varmints doesn't have quite the same skill set.....

Sure he does. "Joe Schmoe" has probably had more range time than any buckethead fresh out of basic. This might be difficult for you to believe (because you're an idiot), but you don't exactly have to be a SEAL Team Six member to be proficient with a weapon.

you're saying that a round fired from an AR-15 style weapon produces no muzzle flash and no sound?

No, as a matter of fact, that is not what I said. I didn't say anything of the sort. You claimed that firing it indoors would render you blind and deaf and spin you around. They will do no such thing. Oh, and even if they did, wouldn't they also render the intruder blind and deaf? Oh..err, uh... Yeah, that's right, dumbfuck. Well, it's fortunate that a shotgun has no flash or recoil and is completely silent.

now that was a .223 fired during the daylight and the muzzle flash was pretty obvious, what do you suppose it would look like in a darkened house in the middle of the night....

I guess that's why they make flash suppressors, you fucking idiot. As to recoil, you can see that, despite her totally fucked up firing posture, it barely moved her. I'd like to see her shoot a 12 gauge leaning back like that. She'd be flat on her ass.

look bud, you're not talking to some fucking mook, you're talking to somebody that has worked around guns and has owned guns most of my life

Um, look "bud" I'm talking to somebody who didn't know that you can attach fucking flashlight to a weapon. Sorry if I'm not very impressed at your alleged knowledge of firearms. In fact, I would go so far as to say you really don't know shit about them and are just talking out your ass.

lemme see, a flash suppressor will run you a couple of hundred bucks for a decent one

Wrong again, dicklips. A decent flash suppressor will cost you about ten bucks. A top of the line one will go between 150 and 200.

when I say high capacity I'm simply referring to semi auto rifles that utilize high capacity magazines....

That would be all of them. It's a meaningless term you just pulled out of your ass.

I'll wager I've shot significantly more variations of weapons than you have...

The only gun you've ever shot was your Uncle Johnny's cock when he'd come over to babysit. You very clearly know next to nothing about firearms. Everything you just said was a fucking lie or a bunch of bullshit and all of it was just a smokescreen to cover your original fucked up take that there is "no practical reason" to own 30 round magazine.

[smackaholic]

I'll wager I've shot significantly more variations of weapons than you have.....when you work in a gun store, that's one of the benefits.....you get to try out virtually every caliber of weapon by a wide variety of manufacturers from around the world.....travel to trade shows and get to fire full auto weapons....have you ever fired a full auto soviet made AK? ever fired a HK33? Ever fire a Sig SG540? I've shot those and lots of others.....

Up until your amazingly stupid posts in this thread, I would have taken you at your word about weapon experience. But anyone that thinks that an AR has enough kick to make an anemic 7 year old flinch, is either weapons grade stupid or has never fired one. I have fired its brother the M-16 a fair bit. It kicks like a bb gun. It kicks less than any hand gun. It kicks a lot less than a nine and we won't even mention a shotgun. It has less recoil than M2 does when his buddy sticks his cahk down his throat. As for the AK, sure it kicks more, espeially in full auto. it has a much larger round. But, we ain't talking about full auto AKs now, are we?

[Felix]

Sure he does. "Joe Schmoe" has probably had more range time than any buckethead fresh out of basic. This might be difficult for you to believe (because you're an idiot), but you don't exactly have to be a SEAL Team Six member to be proficient with a weapon.

we're not talking about range time here, we're talking about being woken up in the middle of the night in a potential situation that could be life threatening.....your average AR-15 owner has never been in a situation like that.....it's one thing to be taking pot shots at ground squirrels, it's something else altogether when the target your shooting may be shooting back.....

You claimed that firing it indoors would render you blind and deaf and spin you around. They will do no such thing.

have you ever fired a .223 in close quarters with no ear protection? if you have, I can guarantee you only did it once, because it is loud, and I mean really fucking loud.....assuming an 18 inch barrel length, it would be in the 150db to 160 db range......add a flash suppressor and it could reach into the 170 to 180 decibel range....do you know what a 170 decibels will do to your ears? if you want to find out, grab a small black cat firecracker, light it, then stick your ear about 12 inches from it, that would be about right...if your using a shorter barrel (14 1/2 or 16) it's even louder....

wouldn't they also render the intruder blind and deaf?

it might, but it's really dependent on how far the intruder is away from the gun....but the flash wouldn't be nearly as bright and it certainly wouldn't be near as deafening if the intruder were 25 or 30 feet away as it would be for the cat shooting it....

Well, it's fortunate that a shotgun has no flash or recoil and is completely silent.

I think a shotgun is an even worse choice for home protection than a semi auto rifle

Wrong again, dicklips. A decent flash suppressor will cost you about ten bucks. A top of the line one will go between 150 and 200.

okay say 10 bucks...I know that most people that spend $1,000 to $1,500 on a weapon are always going to cheap out on a flash suppressor....most civilian owned ar type weapons probably are not equipped with flash suppressors, but they'll be happy to find out they can get them for $10 or $20 bucks.....

to cover your original fucked up take that there is "no practical reason" to own 30 round magazine.

you haven't provided me one legitimate reason why civilians need 30 round magazines.....

[smackaholic]

We've provided ample reasons for us. Whether it passes muster with you is irrelevant.

You've yet to provide 1 reason why they shouldn't.

[mvscal]

we're not talking about range time here, we're talking about being woken up in the middle of the night in a potential situation that could be life threatening.....

The reason you go to a range is so you will know what to do in the middle of the night, you shit smeared dumbfuck. Why the fuck do you think soldiers and police spend time at the range?

your average AR-15 owner has never been in a situation like that.....it's one thing to be taking pot shots at ground squirrels, it's something else altogether when the target your shooting may be shooting back.....

What the fuck does that have to do with anything? Your average revolver or shotgun owner has been in that situation? Is that what you're trying to say? Do you even know what you're trying to say at this point?

have you ever fired a .223 in close quarters with no ear protection?

I've fired more 5.56 than you've ever seen and under more conditions than you have ever experienced. They aren't that loud relatively speaking. They aren't much louder than a 9mm and quite a bit less loud than a 12 gauge. They aren't as loud as .357 for that matter.

okay say 10 bucks...I know that most people that spend $1,000 to $1,500 on a weapon are always going to cheap out on a flash suppressor....most civilian owned ar type weapons probably are not equipped with flash suppressors, but they'll be happy to find out they can get them for $10 or $20 bucks.....

Do you have a point here? Did I suggest that a fully tricked out tactical carbine was cheap? No, I didn't. I said that they are the best personal defense weapons available. That's why they are the weapon of choice for police and military forces.

you haven't provided me one legitimate reason why civilians need 30 round magazines.....

Actually, I did. Since your head seems to be stuck up your ass, lets see if this will help shake things loose.

Self defense against an armed intruder or assailant.

[Felix]

I've fired more 5.56 than you've ever seen and under more conditions than you have ever experienced. They aren't that loud relatively speaking.They aren't much louder than a 9mm and quite a bit less loud than a 12 gauge. They aren't as loud as .357 for that matter.

it's 160 decibels without the flash suppressor.....sorry you don't know shit about acoustics, but the simple fact is that at the level, sound can cause some serious physical issues

I said that they are the best personal defense weapons available. That's why they are the weapon of choice for police and military forces.

you mean the guys that have undergone extensive training in high stress situations? yep, it's definitely their choice of weapon

but look, if it gives you any consolation as long as it's legal, I'll defend your right to pack as many 30 or 100 round magazines as you want....I think you should start petitioning the California legislature to overturn the ban on open carry....

[Felix]

You've yet to provide 1 reason why they shouldn't.

because it's not necessary...it has no value for hunting purposes
it simply provides the ability to lay down a lot of rounds in a short period of time.....

[Left Seater]

because it's not necessary...it has no value for hunting purposes
it simply provides the ability to lay down a lot of rounds in a short period of time.....

Doubt the founding fathers had hunting in mind with the 2nd.

[Derron]

The standard load for most semi-auto handguns today is 15-17. What is the point of limiting this to an arbitrary lower number that turns many law abiding gun owners into felons? As for why more than 10 is good, not all of us are Annie Oakley. If shitgoes sideways ('sup derron?) we might not be terribly thrifty with our shooting.

Limit them to 10 rounds for all I fucking care. I can just tape 2 together, if I owned such a weapon, or possessed 30 round magazines,, then I have 20 rounds. What is carrying an extra mag or to going to do ?? If your any good at all, I have heard, that you can drop load and rack in 3 to 4 seconds anyway.

Back to my shotgun analogy, 6 rounds of 00 buckshot is 54 rounds down range very deadly, very fast. Ban those too ?

[Derron]

you need both hands to operate a semi auto rifle, so utilizing a flash light is out of the question....the best choice for most people would be a handgun, revolvers are more reliable, but with a quality gun and quality ammunition, a semi auto is an excellent choice, 9mm at the least, preferably a .40 caliber

So how do you illuminate the threat ? Or do you just blaze away at shadows ?

.....I don't use cheap ammunition and I've never had a bullet jamb in any of my handguns.....

Bullfucking shit. Then you have not put a lot of rounds down range. I don't use cheap ammo either, and I shoot a LOT. I get the occasional jam for one reason or another. Everyone jams now and then except you that is. Tap, rack,bang. Simple as that. If you have never had a jam, how would you know to clear and proceed ?

You should really take that "no jam' skill set of yours and get to the military and police with it. Maybe even the tactical training business's. In fact, if you can package that up, I can guarantee you I can get it in at least three local training venues, 2 of which I teach a class at for older adults on handgun tactics and situational analysis. Eliminating the jam thing would be huge in the training curve.

[Felix]

So how do you illuminate the threat ? Or do you just blaze away at shadows ?

you add the flashlight/laser sighting option as mvscal pointed out

Bullfucking shit. Then you have not put a lot of rounds down range. I don't use cheap ammo either, and I shoot a LOT. I get the occasional jam for one reason or another. Everyone jams now and then except you that is. Tap, rack,bang. Simple as that. If you have never had a jam, how would you know to clear and proceed ?

okay let me qualify this.....when I use expensive ammunition, I've never had a jamb....when I've used cheap ammuntion (Federal, CCI, Winchester White Box) they've jambed.....but when I shoot quality ammo, I've yet to have any of my pistols jamb on me....

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

...needs to have his ass turned over to m2.

I would rather be water-boarded by North Koreans.

[mvscal]

It's jam, you idiot. You're just like Gene Stoner and John Browning all rolled up into one.



You know as much about weapons as Nick Felchco knows about structural engineering. You never get tired of kicking your own ass either. Why don't you go ahead and "jamb" your shit takes straight up your ass.

[Felix]

It's jam, you idiot. You're just like Gene Stoner and John Browning all rolled up into one.



You know as much about weapons as Nick Felchco knows about structural engineering. You never get tired of kicking your own ass either. Why don't you go ahead and "jamb" your shit takes straight up your ass.

you seem to be pretty upset....I'd suggest either a swedish or hot stone massage....in your case, I think I'd go with the hot stone because it's much better for relieving PMS symptoms.....

[mvscal]

Elkins Park man killed after forcing his way into apartment
Sam Wood, PHILLY.COM
Posted: Monday, April 22, 2013, 1:46 PM

An Elkins Park man was killed late Friday after he forced his way into a stranger’s apartment in Cheltenham Township.

Jasper Brisbon, 32, wandered up to a couple late Friday at the Lynnewood Apartments as the pair spoke outside their unit. Brisbon, they told police, appeared to be on drugs. He stared at the pair for several minutes before the couple decided to go into their apartment, police said.

But as they entered their home Brisbon jumped between them, forcing his way in.

The male of the couple ran to get a semi-automatic AR-15 rifle and insisted Brisbon leave. Brisbon refused. Instead, as the man yelled “Stop! Stop Stop!” Brisbon moved menacingly toward the man, police said.

The man fired a shot striking Brisbon in the torso and immediately called 911, police said.

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/local ... tment.html

Looks like a practical use to me. You can go now, feelsdix.

[Derron]

It's jam, you idiot. You're just like Gene Stoner and John Browning all rolled up into one.

I was giving him the benefit of the keyboard typo, but twice in a row seems unlikely.

[smackaholic]

It's jam, you idiot. You're just like Gene Stoner and John Browning all rolled up into one.

I was giving him the benefit of the keyboard typo, but twice in a row seems unlikely.

I counted 3.

[Felix]

Elkins Park man killed after forcing his way into apartment
Sam Wood, PHILLY.COM
Posted: Monday, April 22, 2013, 1:46 PM

An Elkins Park man was killed late Friday after he forced his way into a stranger’s apartment in Cheltenham Township.

Jasper Brisbon, 32, wandered up to a couple late Friday at the Lynnewood Apartments as the pair spoke outside their unit. Brisbon, they told police, appeared to be on drugs. He stared at the pair for several minutes before the couple decided to go into their apartment, police said.

But as they entered their home Brisbon jumped between them, forcing his way in.

The male of the couple ran to get a semi-automatic AR-15 rifle and insisted Brisbon leave. Brisbon refused. Instead, as the man yelled “Stop! Stop Stop!” Brisbon moved menacingly toward the man, police said.

The man fired a shot striking Brisbon in the torso and immediately called 911, police said.

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/local ... tment.html

Looks like a practical use to me. You can go now, feelsdix.

I never said the semi auto was not an effective weapon, I said it's a bad choice for the average citizen for home defense.....and how many shots did he fire? one...apparently that 30 round magazine wasn't necessary after all.....

I'm guessing had the man pulled a 9mm, .40, .357, or even a .38 handgun, the result would have been the same.....

want to try again?