How to rebuild in SWFLA.

[smackaholic]

Or any coastal lowland shithole for that matter.

To save a few dollars, residential construction in such areas, particularly in the south, has always been slab on grade.

Personally, I think SOG construction is the suck, primarily because it means potentially having to jackhammer your slab for any future plumbing issues.

Building on a crawlspace costs a few bucks more and comes with it's own issues. A big one being that old fukks in wheel chairs have trouble getting into them.

If you have 88 money, you just build on an acre or two where you have the real estate to build a place that might stay dry. Better yet, you put the whole think on piers, poor a slab underneath an park your cars there.

But for poor fukks living in trailer parks, why not just put the fukking things on barges? It could be metal framed with some sort of flotation or possible just a concrete box. If you had a row of these with maybe 15-20 ft between them, you could tie them all together with cables and maybe every few, you have some sort of piling system where they are tied to these pilings with a loop. Look at any tidal dock and you'll see what I am talking about.

Singlewide trailers are generally pretty uniform in their sizing, so this sort of concrete box construction could be mass produced to keep the costs reasonable.

You could place these boxes on a gravel bed, with concrete ties similar to railroad ties every few feet. This would eliminate the problem of them sticking to the ground if you just mounted them on soil.

And a pre-emptive go fukk yourselves to the Climate Change morons. Building more windmills isn't going to make hurricanes go away. As this storm was bearing down on Tampa (which it missed, BTW) the CCMs were wringing their hands. "worst hurricane to hit Tampa in 100 years" To that I would reply, yeah, 100 years ago, when CO2 levels were appreciably lower, they got did by a similar storm.

Many millions of people live in places like this. Time to start getting smart about the problem and learn how to deal with it rather than spend bazillions that will do jack shit, other than take resources away from real solutions.

[Kierland]

You mean so it would float. Like all those boats that smashed into everything and ended up blocks away from where they started?


You could have been dumb in the Ian thread but no, you had to start a whole new thread to shine a brighter light on your stupidity.

[smackaholic]

Did you read the part where I said they would be tethered so they couldn't float away, dumbfukk?

Those boats were either anchored or they were poorly tethered to flimsy docks.

These concrete barges would be anchored using heavy chain or located by loops on pilings which would allow vertical movement, but not horizontal.

What's your solution? Build more windmills and force temps down to the point that tropical storms don't form?

There are some interesting articles on line about the subject, including cases where they build groups of homes on a single floating platform.

[smackaholic]

Another possibility is to just do what the dutch have been doing, successfully for hundreds of years. Dikes and pumps. Just don't let democrats maintain them like they did in Louisiana.

Ever watch any videos of Bjorn Lomborg on the economics of dealing with the climate? He's one seriously smart mofo. Or do you just follow the alarmist morons like AOC and Bernie. Hell, it's pretty much the entire democratic party these days.

[Mikey]

Best solution -

Build somewhere else.

[Kierland]

Did you read the part where I said they would be tethered so they couldn't float away, dumbfukk?

Those boats were either anchored or they were poorly tethered to flimsy docks.

These concrete barges would be anchored using heavy chain or located by loops on pilings which would allow vertical movement, but not horizontal.

What's your solution? Build more windmills and force temps down to the point that tropical storms don't form?

There are some interesting articles on line about the subject, including cases where they build groups of homes on a single floating platform.

Tethered to the ground like the concrete pilings that were holding up the causeway that washed out to sea? No all I saw was you saying they would be tied with a loop, you know, like a boat. Anyways take your “I don’t believe in climate change” BS and shove it up your ass. There are plenty of ways to make your house not float out to sea in a storm. Most involve common, easy to use construction techniques that are not very expensive. You even identified the number one rule, stilts. The second is make your house round which isn’t popular at all but works like a charm cause, well…. Science.

[Kierland]

Another possibility is to just do what the dutch have been doing, successfully for hundreds of years. Dikes and pumps. Just don't let democrats maintain them like they did in Louisiana.

Ever watch any videos of Bjorn Lomborg on the economics of dealing with the climate? He's one seriously smart mofo. Or do you just follow the alarmist morons like AOC and Bernie. Hell, it's pretty much the entire democratic party these days.

Isn’t he the guy who says solar panels suck and the proof is they need subsidies while he is pimping oil which is heavily subsidized? You like him because he says what you want to hear, which is drill baby drill.

First it was, climate change is bunk. Then it was, its natural. Now its, well it’s man made but it’s not that bad. Next it will be, ok it’s bad but what cha gunna do.

If you had half of AOC’s brains you would be ten times smarter than you are today.

June 23, 2006:

...he was afraid that Earth "might end up like Venus, at 250 degrees centigrade and raining sulfuric acid."

Yeah.....right. He should probably stick to theoretical physics. At least with an obscure, esoteric subject like that he can more easily fake it.

That is a scenario that will never happen on this planet under any circumstances. If it were possible, it already would have happened millions of years ago. The so-called "Greenhouse Effect" is not the only or even the primary driver of climate change. There are feedback loops that have yet to be understood or even indentified that prevent the earth from runaway warming or runaway ice ages.

what he said.

The earf apparently has some sort of built in regulating system which keeps our climate within an extremely narrow temperature range needed to maintain life. The fact that "scientists" are getting their panties in a wad over a half degree variation shows just how damn well this works.

Could we fukk it up if we tried? Maybe. I guess we could purposely knock down ever fukking tree possible and spray everything with round up so nothing grows back. We might eventually destroy enough of the CO2 eating vegetation to get ourselves in trouble, but, the fact is, we don't do that. Believe it or not, we actually grow shit back after we chop it down.

Yeah we don’t chop down trees and build parking lots and buildings and roads and…

Fuck you’re an idiot.

[smackaholic]

Did you read the part where I said they would be tethered so they couldn't float away, dumbfukk?

Those boats were either anchored or they were poorly tethered to flimsy docks.

These concrete barges would be anchored using heavy chain or located by loops on pilings which would allow vertical movement, but not horizontal.

What's your solution? Build more windmills and force temps down to the point that tropical storms don't form?

There are some interesting articles on line about the subject, including cases where they build groups of homes on a single floating platform.

Tethered to the ground like the concrete pilings that were holding up the causeway that washed out to sea? No all I saw was you saying they would be tied with a loop, you know, like a boat. Anyways take your “I don’t believe in climate change” BS and shove it up your ass. There are plenty of ways to make your house not float out to sea in a storm. Most involve common, easy to use construction techniques that are not very expensive. You even identified the number one rule, stilts. The second is make your house round which isn’t popular at all but works like a charm cause, well…. Science.

All right, who stole queerland's pwd?

He's actually having a discussion here.

Yes, stilts are the best way to make your house immune to the evil oil company's carnage, but they do have their drawbacks. The primary one being that 87 year olds with bum hips tend not to do well with homes that require climbing a few flights of stairs. You could put in elevators but then you run into that pesky little problem that those of us not born with trust funds have to consider.

Many of these elderly fixed income types live in trailer parks that serve them very well.....till they are become submarines. My mom lives in one in Ft Myers. Well, she did anyway, till a few days ago.

These parks are laid out in rows of 7 or 8 singlewide trailers, usually with a lanai on one side. Thats what they call porches in SWFLA, in case you didn't know. The Lanai is flimsy, lightweight and cheap. It doesn't get space in the boat.

So, lets say in this row of 8 trailers, the end ones have a large piling at either end that is anchored in concrete. Don't tell me you can't make it strong enough. You can.

You site a causeway being washed away. A causeway is a fukking pile of sand and rocks. Cheap to build, but a big storm will wash it out.

So, anyhoo, you have two very well located trailers anchoring each end which can travel in just one direction, vertically. You then run very large chainfrom one "anchor trailer" to the other the 6 trailers in between strung along. You bury this chain in PVC pipe just below the surface to keep it from corroding.

I do agree that we need to look at round houses as well. Use poured concrete using forms that you lift as you pour. A concrete cylinder is an immensely strong structure. It would stand up to a category 5 storm just fine. Put a concrete slab on it for a roof and you are all set. Make it flat with about a 15 degree tilt south and cover it in solar panels.

If you did doors and windows that were reasonably tight, you might even keep the inside reasonably dry with a decent pump.

or, as I have already said, we just hire some dutch civil engineers to show us how to do it the right way. Florida has plenty of sand. Start building dikes around entire communities.

[Mikey]

Funny, I’ve never heard of a hurricane hitting the Netherlands.

[Kierland]

So your take is- fuck granny, she can die from covid. No big, but let’s worry about where she is going to live. Outstanding.

You don’t need to reinvent the wheel, you just need leaders in charge of your building codes, but then you hate gov that actually makes peoples lives better so I doubt you are down for that.

[Carson]

Funny, I’ve never heard of a hurricane hitting the Netherlands.

They did have a major flood in the 1950s.

All their kierlands were drowned , that's why Dutchies are so tall.

[Dr_Phibes]

So how do you lay out the partitions in those? Are the rooms shaped like a piece of pie :?

[Kierland]

If you have no imagination, much like the above poster, I would think the answer is yes. Thankfully, people with round houses have more vision than your average piece of toast.

And props to Carson for FINALLY making a funny.

[smackaholic]

Funny, I’ve never heard of a hurricane hitting the Netherlands.

Nor have I, but give AGW a few years and we likely will. The North Sea does regularly deal up some pretty fukking nasty storms though.

My point was that dikes are a thing and they work quite well, when built and maintained by people who aren't idiots.

Not saying that the entire state needs to be surrounded by a dike, but we might want to look at doing it in places like Ft Myers.

[Dr_Phibes]

average piece of toast.

Eh?

Sorry, I was plotting my lunch when I posted that.
I just had visions of thousands of Yanks drifting out into the Atlantic in round homes. Not that it's unprecedented.



With the right interior decorator you can adapt your RV for those long ocean voyages and seize your provisions from your Caribbean neighbours.

[Mikey]

My point was that dikes are a thing and they work quite well, when built and maintained by people who aren't idiots.

A dike isn’t likely to be damaged by 150 mph winds, but it’s not going to protect anything from those winds, either.


I’m pretty sure that a dike wouldn’t have helped too much here…

[smackaholic]

My point was that dikes are a thing and they work quite well, when built and maintained by people who aren't idiots.

A dike isn’t likely to be damaged by 150 mph winds, but it’s not going to protect anything from those winds, either.


I’m pretty sure that a dike wouldn’t have helped too much here…

You are correct that dikes won’t stop winds. Winds can be dealt with by simply building more robust structures. And apparently round helps too.

But dikes most certainly will hold a storm surge at bay. What needs to be done is to figure out what max storm surge is and build them a few feet higher.

They are just piles of sand. Florida has plenty. Fukk, why not build them even a little bigger and cover them with windmills and PV farms?

Beats the hell out of cutting down forests to put in, like we do in the U&R. You could also get good money for these new hilltops to put up fancy round mansions and throw hurricane parties in them at the next storm.

What’s the alternative?

Continue strip mining the earf in hopes of making enough batteries to power everything off sporadic energy sources?

And let’s we did get to “net zero”?

What if we even went past that and started to actually reduce the atmospheric CO2?

Let’s say we got it all the way down to 1950s levels.

What then?

You’re an old fukk. You might even have a vague recollection of the 50s.

I don’t, but I can read about it. It was an extremely active decade for destructive hurricanes. Possibly even more active than today.

The big difference today is that we have an extra 15 million people there, give or take a few million.

So either we adapt or we accept that when you live in a hurricane zone, you’ll get nasty ones every now and then.

So start pulling up dirt and build round houses.

And yeah, we can keep building “green” energy sources where it makes sense like in the desert to shade pasty fat fukks lying by the pool.

But we just have to start examining where we spend these dollars and how much bang each buck delivers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Diego in Seattle]

You could also get good money for these new hilltops to put up fancy round mansions and throw hurricane parties in them at the next storm.

The round shape is probably good for protecting the structure at large, but I wouldn't want to be near any windows when a Cat 5 is hurling debris at over 157mph....

[smackaholic]

Cylinders built of reinforced concrete are inherently strong. They are also cheap to build. And there's a thing called hurricane shutters

Putting up pics of what happens to flimsy stickbuilt homes doesn't change this fact.

We have two choices here.

We can pretend that we can ban future catastrophic storms by pretending that they'll go away if we suck enough CO2 out of the air.

Or.....we can adapt to a planet that has been warming since the last ice age.

Have we increased that warming?

Tough to say.

We do know that we had a 40 year cooling trend mid 20th century that had the "experts" predicting an imminent ice age.

So what if we have records of very bad storms happening when there were CO2 levels we're never going to see again even if we achieved the best possible level of atmospheric CO2 abatement.

In 1800 CO2 was at about 280ppm. Through 1870, there's a very slow rise with a bit of a dip mid-century.

Around that time, the industrial revolution starts to pick up steam with a fairly linear climb to 310ppm in 1940. There's another curious leveling off during the war. Was this due to a cease in commercial work not related to killing people? Who knows.

After the war is when we really get cranking. In 1960 we are at 316ppm.

In 160 years, we bumped it 34 points. At this time the 3rd world included pretty much all of China and India. Yeah, we evil white folks were burning stuff up pretty well, but everyone else not so much.

Then we spread much of our Carbon flinging lifestyle to these billions of savages and next thing you know.....We put another another 90+ points on the board. In this stretch we better than double the population of the planet. The experts said we'd all starve. Our number one actual health concern is we eat too much.

So, what else has happened over this period?

Satellite data shows we are greening overall. Yes, there are regional droughts, as always, but in total, more vegetation because, well, 4th grade science. Plants like this pollutant we call CO2, so it seems. When they have more, they grow betterer. And they do it with less water. This is all botanical facts, not theory.

As I have already asked you chick little climate fukks, watch a Bjorn Lomborg video or two.

He's no oil company shill. He thinks raising CO2 levels are a concern. But he can look at it rationally.

His main point is that poor people burn everything in site just to stay alive. They're too busy trying to survive to worry about pollution levels.

Therefore, we need to make these fukkers rich, ASAP. Because when they're rich, they have the luxury of giving a fukk about their environment. He points out that in the last 30 years we've made enormous gains in this area. We have pulled billions out of abject poverty. And there is one sure fire way to get more out.

Cheap, reliable power.

Period.

He goes on to say that in the short term, that means carbon. And nuke.

He goes into the simple material and economic facts that make our current fascination with "green energy" silly. We don't have the battery materials and the costs are prohibitive.

He points out that if higher CO2 levels do mean a degree or two more average temp, it is well within our ability to adapt, assuming we have the energy needed to power this adaptation.

He is all for investment in future energy sources, be they improvements on existing nuke tech or the nuke holy grail, fusion. And we should develope others that don't yet exist. Just stop throwing money down the green rabbit hole which do little more than make energy expensive.

Here are a few videos worth your time, mikey, as you are a fairly tech savy hippie. Won't bother trying to convnce the rest of the leftists here as there's no point in talking to relious zealots, be they Muslims or green energy variety.

[Kierland]

Most of that is a wall of noise but props to you for learning a little about the physics of round structures.

[Wolfman]

Basically I'm living on a giant sand bar. Getting blasted by a hurricane every 5 years or so seems to be the price I pay for living here. This was the first time that access to some of the barrier islands was cut off. The biggest PIA to me was power outage for a couple days.
BTW---I saw where some "Dome-shaped" homes in my area were toast.

[Mikey]

Basically I'm living on a giant sand bar. Getting blasted by a hurricane every 5 years or so seems to be the price I pay for living here. This was the first time that access to some of the barrier islands was cut off. The biggest PIA to me was power outage for a couple days.
BTW---I saw where some "Dome-shaped" homes in my area were toast.

Were the domes completely lopped or did Ian just take up residence in them?

[Wolfman]

Supposedly "hurricane resistant", the Dome Homes are no longer. Do a search for the story on them if you want more info.

[Kierland]

It was built in 1982 damaged in a Andrew ‘92 when the windows broke then never fixed. Survived Wilma and Irma with no maintenance for a couple of decades and then finally fell into the water after Ian. So the reason you didn’t post that article is because it doesn’t fit your world view of “Beaver Cleaver in a square box” eh?

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

As a Florida resident I should probably weigh in here.

Florida is flat. Like hella fukking flat. Flatter than Suzie Erickson who I felt up in 8th grade after watching invasion of the body snatchers. She was laying on her back and I grabbed a hand full of what I thought was tit and fumbled around looking for a nipple before I realized I was groping her rib cage. Her titties were flatter than her ribs I swear to god they were.

So yeah... Florida is flat like that. When it rains like a bastard the water has nowhere to go. What's it gonna do? Run down hill? There's a reason we ain't got no hydroelectric power plants down here. The ocean is 20' down hill and 5 miles away. That's a grade of like 0.01% or something. How well does 100,000 gallons of water drain off a flat pan? It don't! Better hope the sun dries it out.

If rain and storm surges were the only problems we could build on stilts and shit. But hurricane winds are nearly impossible to guard against unless you're ultra wealthy and then you have to build an ugly concrete barracks. Rich people tend to build pretty things. They also have insurance so most million dollar homes don't look like a sanitorium from the 1900's. They're pretty and when they get wrecked, rich people rebuild. Imagine that.

So what's to be done? Not a whole lot. Adults need to act like adults, mostly. If you're wealthy, good for you. Stop bitching. Realize you live on a cookie sheet floating in the middle of a swimming pool and act accordingly. Buy flood insurance. Yes, it's expensive. Buy it or fuck off to North Carolina where you halve your chances of getting your shit wrecked. If you're poor, live a replacement lifestyle. Don't get attached to stuff. Don't buy a $70,000 trailer house, put it on concrete blocks, and hope for the best. Buy a $5000 travel trailer, remove the axles, and set it on its frame. When it blows apart like a dandelion gone to seed, go buy another one or fuck off back to Iowa.

Living in Florida is a roll of the dice but they are big dice and your odds are actually quite good. For all the Weather Channel's breathless coverage of tropical storms, hurricane damage is generally fairly localized and infrequent. Don Lemon can fuck all the way off with his bullshit while we're on the subject. During Ian I went to Arkansas. I keep my most valuable possessions mobile and when the weather gets dicey we pack up and head out.

Sometimes humans get pretty arrogant and think they can prevent every little thing. Not so. Sometimes you gotta deal with shit because you can't control it. If you don't realize that... well then you haven't lived very long and you should probably listen more and say less.

[Kierland]

So to recap: you are sophomoric hence the story about you in 8th grade, you have no taste in architecture cause you say rich people build pretty stuff, you have no idea how the building code works when you say you have to be ultra wealthy to build a strong house, and you are a pussy cause you just give up and say get used to losing your stuff cause the rich dicks hoarded all the wealth.

End stage Capitalism at its stupidest.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

So to recap: you are sophomoric hence the story about you in 8th grade, you have no taste in architecture cause you say rich people build pretty stuff, you have no idea how the building code works when you say you have to be ultra wealthy to build a strong house,

No, not really. You got it all wrong. To summarize: I am popular with the chicks because I'm a certified badass. Plus I make them laugh. Chicks want guys who are funny, not just look funny. Have you seen Pete Davidson? That guy is grabbing the titties of Hollywood's hottest women while looking like Ghengis Khan had a butt baby with Pinhead from Hellraiser. Why? Because he's funny. Comedy is like a magic trick that removes girl clothes.

Suzie grew up to be one of the hottest girls in town, by the way. I get to say I knew her before she was hot. She hates it when I do that! I swear to God she does.

Also to summarize since you did it so badly, Florida is flat and large quantities of water are an asshole to it. Wind is a bastard. And structures that can withstand both are expensive and still there are no guarantees. People who bitch about Florida weather should live somewhere else, that's all.

you are a pussy cause you just give up and say get used to losing your stuff cause the rich dicks hoarded all the wealth.

You don't make any sense. I said to live a simple lifestyle in case the weather decides to hit the reset button on your stuff. Not everything needs to be a political pissing match. Sometimes the weather just sucks.

The only thing rich people are hoarding is access to all the broadcast baseball games. I swear to bob it sucks. I have the MLB subscription but also gotta have Apple TV, Hulu, and Peacock. Plus Youtube sometimes. And even then the Rays games are blacked out to force in-person attendance.

I borrowed by best friend Scottie's VPN and my cousin's Cox login to watch that shitty 5 hour long game yesterday. Screw the Guardians and their rookie walkoff homerun. I'm calling them the Indians again out of spite.

hashtag walloftext

[Kierland]

This is the kind of “talent” that’s being encouraged to hop on board?
Dude, you’re a barely sentient leech field.
“Boobs and Baseball- Boobs and Baseball”

… in a hurricane thread.

[Screw_Michigan]

This is the kind of “talent” that’s being encouraged to hop on board?
Dude, you’re a barely sentient leech field.
“Boobs and Baseball- Boobs and Baseball”

… in a hurricane thread.

Be nice to these guys. They're new blood, remember?

Sincerely,
Smackie Chan

[Peter Duncan]

Wow, a perfect warm loaf for wank. Easy does it boys push it in slow don't break the crust. Scoop some out first if you are in a hurry. Ok to lather up with butter, or bacon grease, if you feel messy.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

Wow, a perfect warm loaf for wank. Easy does it boys push it in slow don't break the crust. Scoop some out first if you are in a hurry. Ok to lather up with butter, or bacon grease, if you feel messy.

Yes! This is the kind of advice hurricane victims need. It sucks your house turned into a boat for 2.125 seconds before transitioning to marine habitat but what's done is done. What matters in the aftermath is getting a good mind-clearing nut.

Your next few moves are critical. Do you rebuild? Move? Loot the local Ace Hardware for a circular saw and some Slim Jims? A man's gotta have his head in the right place in times like these.

You see a loaf of bagged bread floating in the ditch, grab that bitch by the hair tie and grease it up with a half bottle of 80/90 weight.

After aborting 5 million potential retards into the yeasty vag of a french loaf you're going to feel undeafeatable. You're gonna like Klaus Fucking Schwab buying all the fresh water rights from a 3rd world shithole.

Now you're ready to score that saw and generator from Ace Hardware. Start scavenging and sectioning lumber for your rebuild. You're not going anywhere, Champ. You just whispered back, "I am the motherfucking storm."

[Kierland]

Good gawd you people suck at using words.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

Don't listen to him, Peter. Kierland's just mad you didn't threaten anyone from an opposing political party. In his world that's what words is for. For hate. If he can yell at enough people... or yell enough times at the same people he can save the whole world. Basicaly he's like Jesus but with Fashism.

[Kierland]

You are the one that has to live you life as a parody of a modern male.

[Softball Bat]

Not everything needs to be a political pissing match.

Truth.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

Good gawd you people suck at using words.

You are the one that has to live you life as a parody of a modern male.

Glass houses.

[Kierland]

Ah yes typosmack. We are so glad to have our new tards on board.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

You defined the rules of the game. Don't get mad when I get a bunt single.

[Kierland]

You’re just pulling shit out of your ass at this point.

[smackaholic]

I have discussed the various rebuilding strategies with a couple of buddies who know a thing or two about the topid. One owns an excavating business. The other is a civil engineer. They are both on the build cheap, build often team.

They make a valid point. They say that it doesn't happen often. The last direct hit on Ft Myers was in 1938.

They very well may be right, but I do think that we should look into dikes in areas with enough of a concentration of development. They are cheap. Don't take much to keep up and provide some advantages.

You can build atop them....with Queerland's roundhouses, of course. These places could even have basements as they'd be above the water table. And basements are cheap to cool, which is an advantage in a place that needs AC pretty much 24/7/365. OK, maybe 315. They actually do have a month or two when heat and humidity takes a little time off.

IMO the dikes are the best long term solution. It's not like you need to tear them down and replace them every 20 years. If anything, they become more secure over time as they settle and vegetation takes hold.