Kiss Crosby Goodbye

[fix]

Word to your salary cap Gary...

Crosby negotiating with Swiss club


Canadian Press



7/6/2005 4:55:59 PM

Hockey phenom Sidney Crosby is in contract talks with Swiss club Lugano, The Canadian Press has learned.

With the NHL set to unveil a new collective bargaining agreement with tough new limits on entry-level contracts, a source said Wednesday that Crosby has been offered a three-year deal that could be worth as much as $10 million US including a multimillion-dollar signing bonus by the Swiss club.

Crosby's agent Pat Brisson of IMG admitted negotiations were taking place. But he would not confirm any financial details.

"I can't deny that we've been in serious talks with Lugano," Brisson said Wednesday from Los Angeles. "It's a serious offer. We're keeping in mind that Sidney's goal is to play in the National Hockey League but we have to listen.

"Not knowing what the entry-level restrictions will be in the upcoming CBA, we need to cover our bases," Brisson added.

The next collective bargaining agreement is believed to cap entry-level salaries to a maximum of $850,000 a season over three years, the same amount it was 10 years ago. Hard-to-reach bonuses could be worth as much as $3 million but they won't be gimmes like the previous deal.

Should Crosby sign the deal before even being drafted by an NHL team, Brisson said there would be some kind of out clause that would allow him to return to North America if he chose to.

"We would want some sort of mechanism which would allow him to come back if he wanted, but it could come at a price" Brisson said.

Other clubs in Europe, notably in Russia, were also believed to have interest but Lugano is the only team in talks with Brisson and Crosby at this point.

Brisson would not comment asked when and if Crosby would sign with the Swiss club.

Goalie David Aebischer of the Colorado Avalanche, forwards Jason Blake of the New York Islanders, Martin Gelinas of the Calgary Flames, Alex Tanguay of the Avalanche and defenceman Kimmo Timonen of the Nashville Predators all played for Lugano last season during the NHL lockout.

Either way, the money continues to pour in for the talented youngster. Gatorade became the second major company this year to hitch its wagon to the rising star by signing the native of Cole Harbour, N.S., to a three-year endorsement deal that was announced by the company Tuesday.

Crosby, 17, signed with Reebok in March in what was reported to be a $2.5-million US, five-year endorsement deal for equipment and apparel.

While the Gatorade deal is not believed to be as lucrative per year as the Reebok contract, it is still reportedly the richest deal a hockey player has signed with the sports drink company.

Crosby, a Canadian Hockey League MVP the past two seasons while playing for the Rimouski Oceanic, is considered far and away the No. 1 prospect for the 2005 NHL draft. The draft will likely be held in early August.

Let's see... at the very least, $10 million to play in the Swiss league or $2.4 maximum to play in Gary's NHL...

That's 7.5 million reasons of why Crosby should say, kiss my ass goodbye for the next three years Betteman.

And from all accounts, the other next great thing, Alexander Ovechkin has all but said NYET to playing under Gary's new world order in the near future.

[T REX]

NWO? That is funny. Have you ever taken an accounting class? Maybe at community college or something....adult night school?

Simple math. The NHL had to fix their dynamics to stay solvent. You could not have escalating costs of 10-15% yearly and revenues SHRINKING each year. You end up going out of business. How's that for a NWO? Sign the kid for $20 million and then you can't afford to pay him.

This is REALITY. The owners were losing money. How long do you think that can go on before teams start going belly up?

Yeah, I am sure you a real Donald Trump behind your keyboard.

[fix]

NWO? That is funny. Have you ever taken an accounting class? Maybe at community college or something....adult night school?

Simple math. The NHL had to fix their dynamics to stay solvent. You could not have escalating costs of 10-15% yearly and revenues SHRINKING each year. You end up going out of business. How's that for a NWO? Sign the kid for $20 million and then you can't afford to pay him.

This is REALITY. The owners were losing money. How long do you think that can go on before teams start going belly up?

Yeah, I am sure you a real Donald Trump behind your keyboard.

Hey, it's Gary's NWO.. he's made it so. Don't blame me for players deciding to play elsewhere now when other leagues offer them what they're really worth.
If teams can't afford to manage their own money or don't have what it takes to survive, they either need to be moved, sold to someone that does have the financial assets or shouldn't be in business to begin with.

And a few teams going belly up would have been the best thing to happen to the NHL.

[JD]

This will never happen.

I'm sure Reebok and Gatorade will be REAL happy to see their newly signed product-pusher playing in some obscure Swiss league.

Crosby will lose those endorsement deals and any other potential deal that would have come his way.

Besides, elite hockey players like Crosby should want to play in the best league. Who could look themselves in the mirror knowing they could have been measuring themself up against the best in the world rather than floating through an inferior league making a couple extra million dollars?

Oh, right. Raghib Ismail. That's about it.

If that's the kind of heart and mind Crosby has, he'll never make it in the NHL anyway.

[Cross Traffic]

Swiss League is lower on the totem pole than the AHL. Only reason players go there....tax free money.

[Hapday]

This will never happen.

I'm sure Reebok and Gatorade will be REAL happy to see their newly signed product-pusher playing in some obscure Swiss league.

Exactly. Nice chicken little routine Otis, but your NHLPA 'boys' got their asses handed to them and have lost on everything. You are just going to have to deal with it.

Just like Gretzky and Jordan, the money Crosby will make as a pro is small compared to what he will make through sponsors.

[fix]

This will never happen.

I'm sure Reebok and Gatorade will be REAL happy to see their newly signed product-pusher playing in some obscure Swiss league.

Exactly. Nice chicken little routine Otis, but your NHLPA 'boys' got their asses handed to them and have lost on everything. You are just going to have to deal with it.

Just like Gretzky and Jordan, the money Crosby will make as a pro is small compared to what he will make through sponsors.

Reebok and Gatorade are only sold in North America?

:roll:

If either of you had heard Pat Brisson talking about these deals you'd have also heard him say that the deals were worked out and apply to the strong possibility of Sidney playing overseas.
They had a representative from Gatorade.ca on the radio also discussing the deal and he said that they had no problem with Crosby playing overseas since his name is one that could be marketed worldwide.

Hap... if what they're reporting is true, then this current deal is still better than the one the league offered in February.
With revenue increases, the cap could go as high as $50 million. Plus there is also a bottom cap now so that the bottom feeding owners of the league can't get away with not spending money on players. They also made gains on free agency, medical.
I'm disappointed that the rich teams will be forced to carry the weak and that there wasn't luxery taxes involved though.

[Hapday]

Hap... if what they're reporting is true, then this current deal is still better than the one the league offered in February.

Huh? I don't think so. It has gotten a lot worse, a lot worse. The teams now can't sign a player for mor than one fifth of the salary cap (for example), that was never there before.

Spin away Otis, but this is the most lop-sided victory in collective bargaining since the NBA deal if not ever.

[BSmack]

Swiss League is lower on the totem pole than the AHL. Only reason players go there....tax free money.

Not for much longer if they can pull top flight stars from the NHL.

[Hapday]

Swiss League is lower on the totem pole than the AHL. Only reason players go there....tax free money.

Not for much longer if they can pull top flight stars from the NHL.

If Eurpoean clubs want to do that and lose even more money than the NHL teams did, they should go for. At the end of the day it's still the NHL that plays for the Stanley Cup. This will only make the NHL a better league. Players going over to Europe to play are just making it publicly known what their motivations for playing hockey truley is. I hope they don't let the door hit their ass on the way out.

[JD]

Reebok and Gatorade might be available in Europe, but you can be guaranteed their core market is in North America. Not only that, Sidney Crosby's core fan-base is here.

Who in Europe knows or cares about who he is?

So Sid has to "put up with" making a mere million per year for 3 years under this new agreement. By the time he's 21, he'll be the highest paid player on whatever team he plays for and everything will be just dandy in Crosby-land. If he does go to the Swiss league, it will be because of bad advice. He won't be worth nearly as much over there as he will be here.

And beyond all of that, wtf has Crosby ever done to deserve a big contract in the NHL anyway? I'm GLAD kids have to prove themselves before they are rewarded with big money under the new deal. It makes sense. If kids like Crosby wanna be babies about it, fine, they can take Hap's advice. But from what I've seen of this kid's character, I really don't think that's the route he'll go.

[Hapday]

And beyond all of that, wtf has Crosby ever done to deserve a big contract in the NHL anyway? I'm GLAD kids have to prove themselves before they are rewarded with big money under the new deal.

RACK!!

But from what I've seen of this kid's character, I really don't think that's the route he'll go.

I agree. I would very surprised if Sidney went. If Alexander Ovechkin goes back who gives a fuck? I know I won't.

[BSmack]

Swiss League is lower on the totem pole than the AHL. Only reason players go there....tax free money.

Not for much longer if they can pull top flight stars from the NHL.

If Eurpoean clubs want to do that and lose even more money than the NHL teams did, they should go for. At the end of the day it's still the NHL that plays for the Stanley Cup. This will only make the NHL a better league. Players going over to Europe to play are just making it publicly known what their motivations for playing hockey truley is. I hope they don't let the door hit their ass on the way out.

The fact remains that the NHL has put an artificial barrier in place that will allow European teams to compete for the best players on an unequal playing field. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that if the best Euro clubs join forces, they could create a league that would be the equal or better of the NHL. It is certain that the days of the NHL as the only choice for top talent are behind us.

[Hapday]

The fact remains that the NHL has put an artificial barrier in place that will allow European teams to compete for the best players on an unequal playing field. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that if the best Euro clubs join forces, they could create a league that would be the equal or better of the NHL.

It also doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that European league wouldn't get any attention on this side of the pond. The best hockey players in the world (Canadian) will still grow up dreaming of playing for the Stanley Cup, and the NHL still has that.

Knowing the heart and character displayed by almost all of the Canadian and North American players, I highly doubt they will suddenly play on the other side of the pond for more money.

You union appologists can avoid reality and come up with numerous 'Chicken Little' type of scenerios, but the bottom line is your boys got slaughtered at the negoiating table this time.

[JD]

Hey, if guys wanna go to Europe and help the Euro owners lose money, they can be my guest. I'll drive their money-hungry asses to the airport.

But the NHL has decided it no longer wants to be a money-losing enterprise. Good on them, and the players are just going to have to live within those confines. Confines which, I may add, STILL ALLOW THEM TO MAKE A LOT OF MONEY.

I'm not concerned about seeing Jarome Iginla begging on some Calgary street for cash, dreaming of scraping up enough change to get himself a plane ticket to the fertile hockey world of Europe.

Again, if a player wants to prove that they're one of the best, they'll want to come to the NHL and play with and against the best. Low salaries didn't stop Loob, Kurri, or the Stastnys in the 80's from coming over here.

[Shoalzie]

Yeah, playing in Switzerland is going to do wonders for your career. He could stay in North America and potentially become the next transendent name in hockey or he can go make his money in Europe and never be heard from again. With the new deal being signed soon, there's no way he leaves for Europe. The draft lottery will be evenly weighed where he could play for any of the 30 teams. Imagine him in Chicago, Los Angeles or New York? Crosby has already signed endorsement deals with Gatorade and Reebok...he's in place to become the face of the NHL. He might not make a ton in salary with the league but if he becomes a superstar, the endorsements will be rolling in and he'll have enough money to be happy. He'll never reach Gretzky status but the NHL will try everything in their power to keep him here and he'll become the league's cornerstone for the next decade.

[BSmack]

It also doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that European league wouldn't get any attention on this side of the pond. The best hockey players in the world (Canadian) will still grow up dreaming of playing for the Stanley Cup, and the NHL still has that.

Knowing the heart and character displayed by almost all of the Canadian and North American players, I highly doubt they will suddenly play on the other side of the pond for more money.

You union appologists can avoid reality and come up with numerous 'Chicken Little' type of scenerios, but the bottom line is your boys got slaughtered at the negoiating table this time.

Oh, so if you were offered a couple of million MORE than you are making now to live and play hockey in Switzerland, you would REFUSE it?

Yea right. And the Stanley Cup is what it is because the NHL has the best players in the world. But don't think that can't change.

[Hapday]

Oh, so if you were offered a couple of million MORE than you are making now to live and play hockey in Switzerland, you would REFUSE it?

If I were in Crosby's situation? Quite easy actually. I don't think Crosby is going to go broke any time soon playing for the Stanley Cup, and getting a shitload of media attention in his home country. His value, in relation to sponsorship possibilities, is a lot higher if he stays here.

Who gives a shit what trophy his Swiss team would play for? It would be meaningless.

You union appologists would love to see Crosby, and others, go play over in Europe and get more money because it would be a 'fuck you' to the owners and the salary cap. The reality is it would be revealing what matters most to those players.

The only ones that will stay in Europe to play for more money are Euros. The only North Americans that will go over are either going to be scrubs who are draft pick busts, or veteran players who have won cups and just want to cash in before they retire in a year or two. Who gives a shit if they do? No matter what league they are in, it will never get to be as big as the NHL.

[BSmack]

If I were in Crosby's situation? Quite easy actually. I don't think Crosby is going to go broke any time soon playing for the Stanley Cup, and getting a shitload of media attention in his home country. His value, in relation to sponsorship possibilities, is a lot higher if he stays here.

You do know that Europe is not exactly the 3rd world? Plenty of Euopean based athletes make big time money in endorsements and salaries.

Who gives a shit what trophy his Swiss team would play for? It would be meaningless.

Right now it would be meaningless. If the best players in the world were competing for it, then it would mean something.

You union appologists would love to see Crosby, and others, go play over in Europe and get more money because it would be a 'fuck you' to the owners and the salary cap. The reality is it would be revealing what matters most to those players.

And of course money means NOTHING to the owners. Only the players are greedy. :roll:

The only ones that will stay in Europe to play for more money are Euros. The only North Americans that will go over are either going to be scrubs who are draft pick busts, or veteran players who have won cups and just want to cash in before they retire in a year or two. Who gives a shit if they do? No matter what league they are in, it will never get to be as big as the NHL.

What color is the sky in your world? First you say that only Euros will play in Europe, as if there are no great players from Europe. Then, in the very next sentence, you say that the only North American players that will go to European leagues will be washed up players and busts, convienently forgetting that the NHLs prospective #1 DRAFT PICK is currently negotiating with a Swiss club. .

But hey, feel free to keep dreaming. The sooner the NHL contracts to half its current size the better.

[Hapday]

You do know that Europe is not exactly the 3rd world? Plenty of Euopean based athletes make big time money in endorsements and salaries.

Not even close to what he'll make here and he would be a lot closer to home.

Right now it would be meaningless. If the best players in the world were competing for it, then it would mean something..

If your Aunt had balls she'd be your uncle.

And of course money means NOTHING to the owners. Only the players are greedy. :roll:

There is greed on both sides no question, but only one side seemed to think losing money for years was a bad idea.

The only ones that will stay in Europe to play for more money are Euros.

First you say that only Euros will play in Europe, as if there are no great players from Europe. Then, in the very next sentence, you say that the only North American players that will go to European leagues will be washed up players and busts, convienently forgetting that the NHLs prospective #1 DRAFT PICK is currently negotiating with a Swiss club.

Reading comprehension much? Also, since when did 'negotiating' mean 'signed a deal'?

[BSmack]

You do know that Europe is not exactly the 3rd world? Plenty of Euopean based athletes make big time money in endorsements and salaries.

Not even close to what he'll make here and he would be a lot closer to home.

Actualy, the story quotes the Swiss offer at 10 million for 3 years. The best he will possibly do under the new CBA is 3 million. Even your beer battered brain should be able to do that math.

Oh, and I don't know if you've watched any F1 or Premier League matches, but top level teams and players in Europe can make as much, if not more in endorsements than their North American counterparts. If the best Bettman can do is gravy train sponsors when he isn't even able to properly market his league to TV, then the NHL is FUCKED for top level talent.

[Hapday]

Oh, and I don't know if you've watched any F1 or Premier League matches, but top level teams and players in Europe can make as much, if not more in endorsements than their North American counterparts.

You are as completely stupid as everyone here thinks you are. You are trying to comparing what F1 and Premier League players make in Europe and say a hockey player could make the same. Why don't you make yourself look like more of idiot and say that a NHL player can make as much in sponsorships as a NFL player.

[BSmack]

You are trying to comparing what F1 and Premier League players make in Europe to what a hockey player could make.

No, I am comparing what top athletes in general make in endorsements. A player like Crosby, with the proper marketing and hype could certainly pull as much in Europe as he could in North America. Hell, he's already scored two big deals and those sponsors aren't raising any red flags.

[fix]

You are trying to comparing what F1 and Premier League players make in Europe to what a hockey player could make.

No, I am comparing what top athletes in general make in endorsements. A player like Crosby, with the proper marketing and hype could certainly pull as much in Europe as he could in North America. Hell, he's already scored two big deals and those sponsors aren't raising any red flags.

BSmack, you're forgetting one important detail here, Hap's definition of 'global' only consists of what happens south of the 49th parallel.
Never mind the reports that the new CBA will not have guarranteed contracts in it.
But let it be said that Hap would rather side with fools, if it were his choice, he'd rather play for a max of $2.5 million non-guarranteed than to take a minimum guarranteed $10 million over the same time period.
Only because he's a good corporate lackey.

[tao]

What hand exactly is Crosby's agent playing anyway?

This "leak" about the offers from Euro teams is probably more about Crosby trying to dictate which NHL team he will play for.

If maximizing Crosby's earning potential is his end game, then he will probably want to play in TO, NYR, Colorado, Det maybe even LA or Montreal. So if Buffalo or Atlanta for example win the first pick in the draft, I would expect to hear the Crosby camp say he will head to Europe unless his rights are traded to the team he wants.

(See John Elway for precedent.)

[T REX]

I'm disappointed that the rich teams will be forced to carry the weak and that there wasn't luxery taxes involved though.

Why? Use the NFL model for example. Green Bay has 100,000 people but it competes on the same level as the NY Giants. Carry? All the teams are in this together financially and it is a real shame that you are unable to see the necesscity of fiscal stability. The league will prosper, you'll see.

[Hapday]

But let it be said that Hap would rather side with fools...

These 'fools' just took the NHLPA out to the back of the woodshed and treated them like a red-headed step child. The 'fools' in all of this are NHLPA appologists like yourself and BSmack who still can't see that and will make up 'Chicken Little' scenerio to attempt to spin yourself from reality.

Crosby would prefer to play in NHL


Canadian Press



7/8/2005 2:59:40 PM

CHARLOTTETOWN (CP) - Sidney Crosby said Friday he wants to play in the NHL if there's a season this fall.

While his agent Pat Brisson of IMG is in talks with Swiss club Lugano, the 17-year-old from Cole Harbour, N.S., said playing in Europe is only an option if the NHL's labour situation isn't cleared up. A new collective bargaining agreement is close to being announced.

"Obviously I'm going to consider other places, but if there's an NHL (season) that's where I want be," Crosby said in an interview with CBC News. "Right now, I want to make sure that I have somewhere to go if there is no NHL season, but we're thinking best-case scenario that there's going to be one, so that's what I'm worried about."

Crosby was in P.E.I. to play in a charity golf tournament held by Tampa Bay Lightning star and Island native Brad Richards.

Brisson said earlier this week that any deal with Lugano would most likely contain an out clause to release Crosby back to the NHL. While the story created quite a buzz, the reality is that Brisson and Crosby are simply covering their bases.

Crosby, a Canadian Hockey League MVP the past two seasons while playing for the Rimouski Oceanic, is considered far and away the No. 1 prospect for the 2005 NHL draft. The draft will likely be held in late July or early August.

[Hapday]

But the NHL has decided it no longer wants to be a money-losing enterprise. Good on them, and the players are just going to have to live within those confines. Confines which, I may add, STILL ALLOW THEM TO MAKE A LOT OF MONEY.

I'm not concerned about seeing Jarome Iginla begging on some Calgary street for cash, dreaming of scraping up enough change to get himself a plane ticket to the fertile hockey world of Europe.

Great take JD, but some people on this board a business actually making money is the equivilent of getting cancer.

[fix]

But let it be said that Hap would rather side with fools...

These 'fools' just took the NHLPA out to the back of the woodshed and treated them like a red-headed step child. The 'fools' in all of this are NHLPA appologists like yourself and BSmack who still can't see that and will make up 'Chicken Little' scenerio to attempt to spin yourself from reality.

Crosby would prefer to play in NHL


Canadian Press



7/8/2005 2:59:40 PM

CHARLOTTETOWN (CP) - Sidney Crosby said Friday he wants to play in the NHL if there's a season this fall.

While his agent Pat Brisson of IMG is in talks with Swiss club Lugano, the 17-year-old from Cole Harbour, N.S., said playing in Europe is only an option if the NHL's labour situation isn't cleared up. A new collective bargaining agreement is close to being announced.

"Obviously I'm going to consider other places, but if there's an NHL (season) that's where I want be," Crosby said in an interview with CBC News. "Right now, I want to make sure that I have somewhere to go if there is no NHL season, but we're thinking best-case scenario that there's going to be one, so that's what I'm worried about."

Crosby was in P.E.I. to play in a charity golf tournament held by Tampa Bay Lightning star and Island native Brad Richards.

Brisson said earlier this week that any deal with Lugano would most likely contain an out clause to release Crosby back to the NHL. While the story created quite a buzz, the reality is that Brisson and Crosby are simply covering their bases.

Crosby, a Canadian Hockey League MVP the past two seasons while playing for the Rimouski Oceanic, is considered far and away the No. 1 prospect for the 2005 NHL draft. The draft will likely be held in late July or early August.

Reading comprehension was never your strong suit was it Hap?

Re-read my previous post again, fool.

[T REX]

Mr. Otis, you failed to respond to my post. Let's get back to the financial side of things and defend your weak position.

[fix]

I'm disappointed that the rich teams will be forced to carry the weak and that there wasn't luxery taxes involved though.

Why? Use the NFL model for example. Green Bay has 100,000 people but it competes on the same level as the NY Giants. Carry? All the teams are in this together financially and it is a real shame that you are unable to see the necesscity of fiscal stability. The league will prosper, you'll see.

If they had done so through the use of luxery taxes then sure, I could agree with you.
But forcing the rich teams to share their wealth with franchises that are run on a shoe string budget while their ownership pockets millions...
Why the hell would the owners of profitable teams want to keep propping up false markets?

And moreso, why in the hell should they?

I'll grant you this, Green Bay is a very strong market..

But even you surely have to concede that the NHL is no where near as popular as the NFL and trying to compare what the Packers are doing to say.... Pittsburgh or Nashville is like apples to oranges.

[T REX]

Popularity? Hell no. But their business plan works well. When you put everyone on a level field, competition goes up, fans increase, profit levels increase too. Your perception is what is killing you in this debate. Forget "rich" and "poor", if everyone operates TOGETHER then all will profit. You have to get over your thinking that it is one against the other. On the ice? Of course. Financially, we are all on the same team. One business model, all operating underneath.

My example has nothing to do with "strong market". It has to do with no matter how strong, GB would never be able to compete against a NY or Chicago dollar for dollar in revenues. Never.

That is why you SHARE. The NFL has grown by leaps and bounds with this system. I am not saying the NHL will grow to the same, but you have to look at the NFL model and why they were so successful(even outside the TV deals).

[fix]

Popularity? Hell no. But their business plan works well. When you put everyone on a level field, competition goes up, fans increase, profit levels increase too. Your perception is what is killing you in this debate. Forget "rich" and "poor", if everyone operates TOGETHER then all will profit. You have to get over your thinking that it is one against the other. On the ice? Of course. Financially, we are all on the same team. One business model, all operating underneath.

My example has nothing to do with "strong market". It has to do with no matter how strong, GB would never be able to compete against a NY or Chicago dollar for dollar in revenues. Never.

That is why you SHARE. The NFL has grown by leaps and bounds with this system. I am not saying the NHL will grow to the same, but you have to look at the NFL model and why they were so successful(even outside the TV deals).

Again, why should successful franchise owners be forced to prop up losing markets that will never turn a profit?
That makes absolutely no sense.
And the one big thing you're missing here is that what makes the NFL so damn successful is their TV deal, of which the NHL has none in the U.S.
Nor will they ever because the sport is at best 5th behind the NFL, NBA, MLB, NCAA.

[Hapday]

Reading comprehension was never your strong suit was it Hap?

Re-read my previous post again, fool.

I read it, and as usual you are wrong. Being right has never been your strong suit, has it Otis?

[Hapday]

And the one big thing you're missing here is that what makes the NFL so damn successful is their TV deal, of which the NHL has none in the U.S.

The one thing you are missing is that Green Bay was around loooonnngg before huge TV deals were on the table.

[fix]

Reading comprehension was never your strong suit was it Hap?

Re-read my previous post again, fool.

I read it, and as usual you are wrong. Being right has never been your strong suit, has it Otis?

Oh?

Off the top of my head, when it comes to being right...

And just how many Canadian election predictions have you lost to me over the years?

Me=Right
Hap=Still looking for clues.

[fix]

And the one big thing you're missing here is that what makes the NFL so damn successful is their TV deal, of which the NHL has none in the U.S.

The one thing you are missing is that Green Bay was around loooonnngg before huge TV deals were on the table.

Okay.. and how many home games have they not sold out in the past 20 years?

As say compared to the NHL's Pittsburgh Penguins

Hap, please tell me you're not honestly trying to say that the NHL is as popular as the NFL...

[Hapday]

And just how many Canadian election predictions have you lost to me over the years?

Me=Right
Hap=Still looking for clues.

By my records....one. Nice strawman though. In case you didn't notice this is the NHL forum, try to stay on topic mmmkay.

[fix]

And just how many Canadian election predictions have you lost to me over the years?

Me=Right
Hap=Still looking for clues.

By my records....one. Nice strawman though. In case you didn't notice this is the NHL forum, try to stay on topic mmmkay.

"By my records....one."

Hap Grewal dat you?

Still doctoring your records eh?

That'd be 1 provincial and 2 federal elections... just so that the truth is posted.
All of which were won by the Liberals..In case you hadn't noticed.

Me=3
Hap= Still looking for clues...

[Hapday]

That'd be 1 provincial and 2 federal elections... just so that the truth is posted.
All of which were won by the Liberals..In case you hadn't noticed.

Link?

You are drinking too much of that gLiberal Koolaid. Next you'll tell me there isn't a GST because the gLiberals promised they would get rid of it so gosh darn it, it must be gone!

Once again I will remind you about two things:

1. This is the NHL forum.

2. The owners completely kicked the NHLPA's ass in this new CBA. The only victory the NHLPA can take away is that there is still a union. Other than that they've lost everything.