The Rod of God -- (!) Pages 33 and 34 (!)

[Atomic Punk]

AP, I thought I answered you when I said this to you...

I'm certainly not saying the earth is flat because NASA doesn't show us the other side of the earth.

when you hold a tennis ball, do you see the whole tennis ball all at once?

No, you see half of it.

You just KYOA. Okay, let's try this. Have you ever seen a Lunar or Solar eclipse... as an eye witness... watching it from here... the Earth?

[poptart]

Yes, we do see those.

[Atomic Punk]

the rate compounds as you continue moving further from the object.

It's something like this, isn't it?


[img]big%20picture[/img]

Equal angles = equal arcs

Do you assume the Earth rotates, or the Sun revolves around the Earth? If not, then explain apparent movement and gravity while you're at it. Way over your head isn't it?

...Baby Steps...

[poptart]

AP, as I've said many times now, I don't know for sure what the shape of the earth, sun, moon, stars, planets are.
I know what the Bible says -- and I know what I observe.
Read Genesis 1:14-18.

I observe a flat earth.
I observe the sun and moon both moving -- as the earth is stationary.

Could I be deceived?
I could be.

I've been on a train, sitting still on the tracks.
Another train is on the track next to me.
It is also stationary.
Then that train begins to move - but the sensation I get is that MY train is moving.

So maybe the earth is indeed moving, I dunno for sure.
But I tend to doubt it - and the Bible seems to indicate that it isn't, btw.

I'm most interested in real observation.
I've posted some things here.
The two experiments on this page -- and the Toronto skyline.

People scroll it or wave it off for whatever reason.
I consider it their loss.
I said before, people REALLY don't like it when their round earth is questioned.

There are many other observations.





I'm sure this is insane and many people will tell me.

:)

[Atomic Punk]

By that silly example, you've earlier admitted you've seen a Solar and Lunar eclipse. How does that happen with that rotation pattern you've pooped out? Also, why are there then these things called "seasons?" Why does the Moon not appear some nights and have weird things that look like crescents that seem to move to the other side and disappear for a few days every month? Take your time.

[poptart]

You appear to be fully divorced from reality

You must know that I think even less of you, because from my seat, you decline to even look outside the box which you have decided is "reality."
So be it.



AP,

1. That is merely a very crude diagram intended to show a general model.

2. I don't pretend to have all answers. I have many questions (lunar eclipse among them), and so I explore things.

So then...

3. If you look at the Bible, the moon is not said to reflect light from the sun, as we've been told from childhood.
It is called a lesser light, in comparison to the brighter light, the sun.
Genesis 1:16
This appears to me to say that the moon is producing a light of it's own.

Scroll back to the video I posted about the moon wave.
People who scrolled past this video are like 88, Gay, and others.
Dullards.
And actually even worse than dullards.
Arrogant dullards.
Truth is, they are very frightened people.

So watch it the lunar wave video.


4. Then watch this video...



5. I've seen a number "flat earth" theories regarding the lunar eclipse, and I've not found one (yet?) that I can place confidence in. So I'm looking around.

6. There is an abundance of "flat earth" info on the web.
Do your own looking, if you are inclined.
Or not.
Whatever...

[poptart]

here's a shot from a NASA camera on the Deep Space Climate Observatory: it's too big to post the pic: http://www.nasa.gov/image-feature/nasa- ... arth-image

According to the caption its the first view of the entire sunlit side of Earth from one million miles away

This color image of Earth was taken by NASA’s Earth Polychromatic Imaging Camera (EPIC), a four megapixel CCD camera and telescope. The image was generated by combining three separate images to create a photographic-quality image. The camera takes a series of 10 images using different narrowband filters -- from ultraviolet to near infrared -- to produce a variety of science products. The red, green and blue channel images are used in these color images.

Btw, this new "photographic-quality" image from NASA is so good that it shows large portions of both North and South America -----> completely... gone.

Did you look closely at it?

LOL

Now NASA has removed that image from it's site.
Maybe it's still there somewhere, or maybe they realized the bullshittery stank off of it was just too strong.
Who knows?

Click your link, Scotty.

Anyway, this was it...



As I noted, a large portion of both North and South America is just... gone from their "photographic quality" pic of earth.
You could see it better when they had it on their site, because you could blow it up.
It basically just a cartoon.





Same thing here.
Much of North America is... gone in these trumpeted real images of the moon crossing in front of earth.

Go here and you can blow it up much larger to see their comedy...
https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/file ... itfull.gif





In NASA we trust!

[BSmack]

Keep looking.
Take pics -- and take them on more than one day.

I'd like to see them.

Here's one I took earlier this year. I was checking out some of the lake ice on Ontario. I sized it down. Otherwise it is as is was when I took the picture.



As you can see, I was looking almost due north. If the world was as you say it is, I should see a skyline. Not Toronto,but rather buildings in Prince Edward county.

[mvscal]

WRONG. Top to bottom. But, by all means, continue to fill your head with shit.

lol

You touted measurements and observation -- and I gave them to you.

Both were basic experiments and were not based on any presumptions or... fuzzy math.

They were based on a totally discredited and debunked experiment but I'm sure you don't believe in atmospheric refraction either. Talking snakes and magic apples and you're all in, though.

[Moving Sale]

He already told you why no one has photographed the edge. Antarctica has been shut down.
I can't believe I read enough of this thread to know that.

[Smackie Chan]

poptart - You've challenged conventional wisdom and universally-accepted scientific principles, and for that I applaud you. You've modestly admitted that you don't have all the answers, unlike the arrogant naysayers who blindly consume all the scientific rubbish they've been fed since childhood. You've cited works by obviously brilliant observers of what the world shows us, such as Dr. Rowbotham, of whom I confess I'd never heard. Just so I'm clear on what it is you believe, the earth is flat rather than spherical or ellipsoid, and it doesn't revolve around the sun, but is rather the focal point around which other celestial bodies, besides the moon, revolve. Is that, in a nutshell, accurate? I won't deign to try to answer any of the questions you've posed in this thread because I'm just a simple, pitifully uninformed individual who has none of those answers. But I'm hoping you'll still try to address some of the questions I'll put forth here so I, too, can become as educated and wise as you are.

1. If the earth is indeed flat, then circumnavigation, by which traveling in one direction will lead one back to where one started, is impossible. Are the stories we've been told about Magellan, Elcano, and many others simply lies? If the earth is flat, traveling in one direction (any direction) would lead one to the earth's edge, yet I've never heard any accounts of people reaching the perimeter. Do those accounts exist and they've simply been swept under the rug by the powerful interest groups whose sole mission is to deny God's existence and omnipotence?

2. Obviously, the word "flat" isn't intended to denote pure two-dimensionality. The earth does have depth; otherwise, when people or animals dig, drill, or burrow into it, they would fall through it. How far does one have to dig before poking through its underside? Has anyone discovered what the bottom of the flat earth is composed of? I'm assuming all life and anything that matters sits atop earth's flat surface.

3. You showed a map indicating the earth's land masses are all congregated near the center of its surface, and the oceans represent a buffer between the land masses and the planet's edge. Where does the ocean's water go at the earth's outer bounds? Is there a wall or barrier that keeps it from flowing off the edge? What is the wall made of, and how high is it? There have to be some observations and evidence to provide these answers.

4. Does the entire universe revolve around earth, or just the bodies in our galaxy? Are there other galaxies?

5. Scientists predict with certainty the timing of lunar and solar eclipses using scientific computations that assume earth is spherical. How are they always right if the earth isn't a sphere?

6. Not sure what your take is on gravity, but assuming you have no qualms with it (which is likely to be a bad assumption), the force of gravity is vertical at every point on its surface. If the earth were flat, the force of gravity would slant obliquely towards its center of gravity as one moved toward the edges. How do you explain that this isn't what is observed?

7. I know you have serious issues with NASA and the fact that they do nothing but lie to us. But you do use as evidence to support your claims photos that appear to be taken from space, so I'm guessing you at least believe that man has successfully shot cameras into space that have taken those photos that have, of course, later been doctored to show us what they want us to believe. Have all those photos been taken from the same vantage point? It would appear to be the case since the earth appears as a two-dimensional disc in all of them. Any other vantage point would show something other than a flat, round surface; a photo shot from the the vantage point of the earth's edge would essentially appear to be a line. Do you have any of those photos?

8. If the earth were flat, the sun would rise and set everywhere at the same time. Why isn't this what we observe?

I have many other questions, but don't want to inundate you. Thanks for helpin' me out here, bro.

[Jay in Phoenix]

certifiably insane

Jay, you've had almost NOTHING to add to this thread.

No substance at all.

Name-calling, ridiculous mistakes and hysterics.

You still haven't even gotten to first base with the question I posed as I entered the thread.
lol

Poor showing.
Very poor indeed.

Yes I have pops, you've just chosen to ignore it. on top of that, you are avoiding nearly every question posed to you.

I've offered you fact and numbers for the ridiculous "dark side of the moon" propaganda. I' ve asked you to define orbit, you have buried your head in sands of stupidity. You've challenged almost every photo of the Earth as CGI or doctored. You provide poorly conceived maps, animations and graphs. Again pops, can't you see your own hypocrisy? Where is your untouched photographic proof of a flat Earth?

Yeah, that's right, you don't have any.

Now at the very least, please answer Smackies well reasoned questions, as he at least is showing you some much undeserved respect.

Do it poptroll.

[MgoBlue-LightSpecial]

...

You should invite pop on your show to answer these questions. That is, if he's MAN enough.

[poptart]

They were based on a totally discredited and debunked experiment but I'm sure you don't believe in atmospheric refraction either

Of course the experiments were "debunked."
I would expect nothing less.

Yes, I believe in atmospheric refraction.
Yes, I could post a video debunking the debunking of Dr. Rowbotham's experiments -- and speaking much about refraction.

And so it goes...


Scott, I think space.com is run by NASA.


88, I did answer the question previously about the edge.
And Smackie has asked about it now, also.
So...

Some things I have said in this thread...

1) I'm not saying that I know what the shape of the earth is, or what the real earth map looks like.

2) A theory that I find pretty interesting is that Admiral Byrd found an edge of the earth on expedition to Antarctica -- and you could use the flat map I posted to understand what that might look like.
I posted about him previously and you can go back and read what I said, if you care.
I'm not going to keep repeating things I already posted.
Antarctica was abruptly closed off and to my understanding, you can not even fly over it, except for maybe just over a very small portion of it.

So a theory is, there is a firmament covering the earth, as described in Genesis 1.
There is a wall of ice surrounding the entire earth -- per the map, and the firmament comes down, like dome, and meets at the ice covering on the outer edge of the earth.

Byrd found this... I think is a possibility.
And at that point, the powers that be saw to it that Antarctica was completely closed down.

If the flat earth model I posted is real, it would be VERY difficult (if not damn near impossible) for a man to get to the edge.
By Creator's wisdom?

Upon getting to the front edge of Antarctica, you're in a brutally cold environment on sheets of ice.
No real food source or vegetation.
Perhaps mountains and/or a large ice wall to get over if you're going to get close to the edge.

I do suspect that Admiral Byrd found the edge.
I can't prove it, but it's in my mind.

I don't think any commercial plane "crosses" Antarctica.
If Quantas (or a crusie ship) goes to Antarctica, I could nearly guarantee that all they do is approach, or maybe barely skim into the continent.

As for frustrating people, hey, I'm honest.
I don't KNOW for sure what the shape of the earth is.

What I observe tells me the earth is flat -- and I'm interested in pursuing it further

Admiral Byrd made many expeditions to Antarctica.
He became VERY interested in it.
Said that it was a vast wonderland.
Huge potential and massive untapped natural resources.
Would have been a colossal money-making region -- on a massive scale.

Then twelve countries abruptly signed he Antarctic Treaty in 1959 and since then it's no-goey to Antarctica, fliends.

Nobody is going to tap anything there.
No, no, NO, you don't.
Can't have that.
Resources stay in the ground.

Can't go.
No way.
No how.
You simply will not enter that region.


Un Logo -- which uses a flat earth map -- interesting.




Flat earth model...







Sun and moon mvmt on flat earth?



Yes, what about a lunar eclipse?

My answer: I don't know.

I am exploring and have not found an answer yet that I feel comfortable with.


88's video...

It's very interesting.
I would like to know SO much more about this balloon launch -- and info given is sparse, to say the least.
I am also exploring these things more.

Pilots talking about earth curvature: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travelbu ... black.html


Smackie, so many questions, and many of which I am not qualified to answer.

Circumnavigation
http://aplanetruth.info/11-how-does-a-s ... lat-earth/

And fwiw, the same site is a very good reference for MANY of the concerns in this thread.
You can find many "answers" to your questions here - http://aplanetruth.info/about/
Click the green area and you can see many questions and much info.
It's not possible for me to delve into all of your questions, but much of what you ask about is addressed on this site.

Also, and better yet -- if you care to get one man's overview of flat earth, and why it may not be NEARLY as crazy as one thinks when they initially hear it, watch this documentary.
Take a couple hours and watch it on a weekend.
Don't judge initially.
Just open your mind and see what this man presents.



Or, if you just want to dismiss the whole thing, don't watch it.
No skin off my nose.



Finally, my overall hypothesis is,... I believe the Bible.

Genesis 1:7, 14-18
[7] And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
[14] And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
[15] And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
[16] And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
[17] And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
[18] And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.


I hypothesize that we are in an enclosed system, covered by a firmament, just as God said.
A "Truman Show," sort of.

We never went to the moon.
I have zero faith in anything NASA presents.
The sun and moon are... lights, as God's Word says.
I'm not sure of their dimensions, if they are even real spheres, or how high up the firmament is.




Watch the flat earth clues documentary.

Watch the flat earth clues documentary.

Watch the flat earth clues documentary.

Watch the flat earth clues documentary.


:wink:

[poptart]

...

You should invite pop on your show to answer these questions. That is, if he's MAN enough.

If I am ever on the show, not only will it set an all-time ratings record, it will be a show for the ages.
Bank on that.

Most of you have honestly been extremely boring so far.
I won't be.

[Atomic Punk]

Pops, your animation of the Sun-Moon rotation doesn't reflect what you yourself can see every single day and night. You didn't address on the last page my questions on you explaining lunar and solar eclipses, the concept of gravity, the apparent motion of sky objects, the phases of the predictable Moon cycle... none of that.

Can you explain why there are seasons like I've asked before? You've dodged almost all of my questions. Good thing you know a tennis ball is round by tangible feel. So how is it possible to debate you when you don't want to see reality?

Why is it, you don't look for yourself to see evidence that is right in front of you? Looking up into the sky should be your first move. Just observe and maybe write a journal of what you see over a period of a year.

[poptart]

You didn't address on the last page my questions on you explaining lunar and solar eclipses, the concept of gravity, the apparent motion of sky objects, the phases of the predictable Moon cycle... none of that.

AP, I don't have answers for all questions -- and it's impossible to answer every question and protest that has come up in this thread.

I am exploring and I've given my hypothesis.

I don't believe NASA and I don't believe we live on the kind of round earth we've been told we live on.
I've linked to MANY resources and you can feel free to bump around on them.

Watch the flat earth clues documentary -- and go here ---> http://aplanetruth.info/about/
Click the green area and most likely, replies to your questions can be found.
If not, use Google and see how "flat earthers" respond to things you ask.
It's all out there.

[Atomic Punk]

Pops, did you know all of the things I've asked you about were long long discovered and proven before that evil NASA thingie came to be?

[poptart]

Pops, did you know all of the things I've asked you about were long long discovered and proven before that evil NASA thingie came to be?

If it's all proven, then don't waste any time on me or the thread.

Obviously, I (and millions others) don't believe it's proven that the earth is round.


How are you certain the earth is round?


88, no time now, sorry.
I'll reply later, but very short answer now...

That picture is just a very crude and simple model to give a general idea, as I said when I had previously posted it.
It's one dimensional.

More later...



Watch the flat earth clues documentary and go here -----> http://aplanetruth.info/about/

A lot of your potential questions are addressed there.

[poptart]

Quickly for 88...

Sunrise and sunset explanation from a flat earther.
http://aplanetruth.info/17-if-a-flat-ea ... n-go-down/

There are also a number of youtube videos on the topic.
Do your own search, if you care.

[Atomic Punk]

Because I have navigated aircraft around the world in my early Naval Aviation days using a sextant in the mighty Navy P-3C Orion with an Almanac, maps/charts, sight reduction tables etc. as a back up to Loran, GPS, radar, TACAN/VOR, visual fixes, what have you... to accurately locate my position from land and over oceans to get from Point A to Point B. I was very good keeping course with a sextant within 2 to3 nautical miles while moving around 300 knots across the surface of the planet. The drawback for anything, is you have to have an idea of where you generally are in the 1st place to be able to use a sextant. GPS and land navigation tools makes you dependent.

[trev]

I only made thru 1/2 of this entire thread.

I'm fully convinced that Poptart is trying to get us to pray for him.

Nice angle, buddy!

[poptart]

Because I have navigated aircraft around the world in my early Naval Aviation days using a sextant in the mighty Navy P-3C Orion with an Almanac, maps/charts, sight reduction tables etc. as a back up to Loran, GPS, radar, TACAN/VOR, visual fixes, what have you... to accurately locate my position from land and over oceans to get from Point A to Point B. I was very good keeping course with a sextant within 2 to3 nautical miles while moving around 300 knots across the surface of the planet. The drawback for anything, is you have to have an idea of where you generally are in the 1st place to be able to use a sextant. GPS and land navigation tools makes you dependent.

You have navigated... around the world?

Left-handed while kicking the crap out of Chuck Norris, I imagine.


Well, at any rate, I had never considered all that you posted, so now I will re-evaluate my hypothesis. :)





:wink:

[poptart]

Bloatspray, trev...

Settle in for a nice Sunday afternoon watching Flat Earth Clues.




The guy did a good job with his presentation.

Microwave some popcorn.






Understand, I heard about flat earth some time ago -- and I laffed at it.
Put it aside and didn't consider it.
Then I began to look...

Watch it.
If you do, it will get you to a starting point of understanding why some people want to dig a little (or a lot) deeper into what our actually surroundings are.

[Atomic Punk]

You have navigated... around the world?

Left-handed while kicking the crap out of Chuck Norris, I imagine. Well, at any rate, I had never considered all that you posted, so now I will re-evaluate my hypothesis. :) :wink:

Pretty amazing isn't it? Using celestial bodies with a sextant is so damn tough to navigate. I know, it's tough for only you to consider. It's not like it hasn't been done centuries before NASA.

[poptart]

But you contend they didn't land on the moon and that would make it a fake too, right?

Yes, I contend this picture is fake.
We never went to the moon, imo.

If you didn't watch the Buzz Aldrin clip that I posted -- twice --, you should watch it.

The Apollo 11 crew was busted creating a fake earth image within their space craft -- speaking to ground control about what they were doing, and receiving info and feedback from ground control about the fake earth image they were creating.
The image was shown to the American people -- supposedly a view of earth from WAY FAR AWAY in space, halfway to the moon...
But the truth, as was blatantly revealed to Buzz by the reporter, was that the Apollo 11 crew was creating this fake image as they were in low space over the earth.
There was a time stamp on the NASA video (an out-take) that showed that this trickery was being done on July 18th.
They launched on July 16th, yet here they were still in low "orbit" over earth on July 18th, creating a fake image of earth, supposedly as they were halfway to the moon.

Why were they creating this fake earth image?

Even if we want to somehow discount the accuracy of the time stamp on the NASA video, we still have the Apollo 11 crew manufacturing (and doing so with full knowledge and help from ground control) a fake earth image -- and then passing off to the American people that this is a real shot of earth as they are halfway to the moon.

So they were busted creating fakery.
And Buzz did not react well when confronted on it.

Neither did other Apollo astronauts when this same reporter confronted them with inaccuracies and falsehoods about their supposed trips to the moon.
In fact, they all melted.

I could post that video, as well.
But so far, I don't think many people are watching the videos, so I haven't posted it yet.


Bottom line, what NASA shows us is not to be trusted.

If people want to think this is a real picture, that's their business.

I'm just telling you what I think.

[poptart]

Yes I have pops, you've just chosen to ignore it. on top of that, you are avoiding nearly every question posed to you

Are you a m0ron, or what?

All I've been DOING since entering the thread is responding to an avalanche of questions and protests.
lol

Each question that gets answered is then followed up with a new back-and-forth tangent coming from the original question.
It's simply not possible to answer every question and angle that has flooded me.

You are like a child.

You came in with abuse and name-calling from your first post, failed to answer MY question, which I purposely asked in my first post in the thread.
Yet you expected me to get right to your questions -- as you continued to abuse and name-call.

You're a disgrace.

Shove a fat globe up your ass, dickwad.

[Smackie Chan]

Just open your mind and see what this man presents.

I can do that, too...



Even the God squad has known for centuries that the Earth isn't flat.

there was scarcely a Christian scholar of the Middle Ages who did not acknowledge [Earth's] sphericity and even know its approximate circumference

Of course, when you peddle myth as fact as a way of life, trying to sell a flat earth comes as second nature.

[Felix]

My snow globe analogy wasn't really off base at all

I understand the only book or historical document you believe is the bible.

You consult it for and apply your interpretation to all historical reference to your day to day existence

if science & physical evidence contradict it - then it is a hoax

My question then is ............ why?

Why would there be a worldwide conspiracy to keep masses ignorant?

is it some kind of "test" from God to cull the nonbelievers?

that picture is sometimes referred to as the "Hovind Theory" which isn't really a theory, it's not even a comprehensible thought.....the idea that a giant canopy of water or ice was floating above the earth is so ridiculous and can be discredited in about 6:36 seconds



that video was put together by an engilish cat I occasionally chat with that goes by the name of thunderfoot.....he has an entire series of videos titled "why do people laugh at creationists" which are pretty funny while providing scientific discussion and evidence as to why the claims of creationist folks (like tart) are ridiculous......I like the quote from this video that says the idea of water or ice being in contact with or above the earths atmosphere are both "demonstrably stupid".....

I don't know for sure what the shape of the earth is.
Simple observation tells me it is not round.

what simple observation tells you it's not round? I have a friend of mine that pilots private jets that fly at extremely high altitutdes.....he tells me that when you get to about 45,000 feet (which is higher than any commercial airline will ever fly) you can actually see the curvature of the earth......that's pretty much a direct observation.....so what have you "observed" that would indicate the earth is not round? What is the shape of every other planet in our solar system? they are round and that can be confirmed by me by simply looking through my telescope at Venus, Saturn, Mars and Jupiter.....I own a telescope powerful enough to let me see those planets.......and I took a university astronomy class so I know how to locate each of the above named planets when I'm night sky watching.....every one of them is round and do you know why? it's this little thing called gravity.....the gravitational power of an object is related to it's size, atmosphere, etc. The moon's gravitational pull is significantly lower than the earths because it is considerably smaller......but the tides of the earth are controlled by the gravitational pull of the moon.......you can look into the sky with the naked eye and see the moon is a round ball like shape.....what makes you think the earth would be the only planet in our solar system that's not round? gravity determined the shape of planets when they began to form billions of years after the big bang......scientists believe the earth began to take shape after it collided with a similarly sized object......there were large enough pieces remaining in tact that gravitational pull started drawing them together to create a larger object which we now refer to as earth.....

[Go Coogs']

pops,

I'm a Christian just like yourself, but I can't ride with you on this one. I admire your conviction and challenges of what NASA and scientists tell us to be true and as hard evidence, but I've learned over the years that some things just don't hold water in the good book. I've learned to embrace evolution as a possible outcome of human existence, but consider it a miracle in a sense that something greater (God) out there made this all happen. There is so much that had to go right in order for the Earth to be created and stabilize as a terrestrial planet long enough for life to form. It's crazy to me to think for us to exist we need the perfect atmospheric composition of 79.2 N2 and 20.8 O2. That indeed is a miracle in my eyes.

But at the end of the day, the earth is shaped like a basketball.

[BSmack]

The Apollo 11 crew was busted creating a fake earth image within their space craft -- speaking to ground control about what they were doing, and receiving info and feedback from ground control about the fake earth image they were creating.
The image was shown to the American people -- supposedly a view of earth from WAY FAR AWAY in space, halfway to the moon...
But the truth, as was blatantly revealed to Buzz by the reporter, was that the Apollo 11 crew was creating this fake image as they were in low space over the earth.
There was a time stamp on the NASA video (an out-take) that showed that this trickery was being done on July 18th.
They launched on July 16th, yet here they were still in low "orbit" over earth on July 18th, creating a fake image of earth, supposedly as they were halfway to the moon.

Why were they creating this fake earth image?

Even if we want to somehow discount the accuracy of the time stamp on the NASA video, we still have the Apollo 11 crew manufacturing (and doing so with full knowledge and help from ground control) a fake earth image -- and then passing off to the American people that this is a real shot of earth as they are halfway to the moon.

Not sure why you are posting about Apollo 11 when the "Earthrise" photo was a product of the Apollo 8 mission.

[Jay in Phoenix]

Yes I have pops, you've just chosen to ignore it. on top of that, you are avoiding nearly every question posed to you

Are you a m0ron, or what?

IKYABWAI? Is that the best you have in your loopy little man's arsenal?

Pops, there is the usefull Forrest for the trees analogy I would suggest you apply here, as the bigger picture for yours being seriously mind fucked. Each and every one of your Admiral Byrd sources are conspiracy driven drivel that even LTS would reject as idiotic. No photos, no writings, nothing.

I've been DOING since entering the thread is responding to an avalanche of questions and protests.
lol

Bullshit. All you've been doing is tap dancing and deflecting and you haven't answered a single question directly. Oh yeah, you've gone to the "I don't have all the answers" card now numerous times, but since you started all of this flat Earth rhetoric, you've backed it up with nothing but flat maps, charts, graphs and gifs, none of which are visual or verifiable proof of anything. Yet, you maintain your own arrogant posture of there being no untouched photos of a round planet, while backing yourself up with even lamer, non-provable graphics.

Where are your untouched photos 'tart?

You are like a child.

Awesome, coming from one of the most mentally repressed individuals I have ever read. Sad.

You came in with abuse and name-calling from your first post, failed to answer MY question, which I purposely asked in my first post in the thread. Yet you expected me to get right to your questions -- as you continued to abuse and name-call.

There are still some remnants of a smack board here poptroll, and you have been begging for it. So if it will smooth your delicate, ruffled feathers, from this point I will hold off on all sarcasm if you talk straight and answer some real questions honestly, starting with all of Smackies.

Shove a fat globe up your ass, dickwad.

How very Christian of you. God bless you too.

[Jay in Phoenix]

Tell ya' what poptart, let's just simplify this down to the one, most intrinsic question.

Why is NASA, or anyone else, covering up the "truth" of the Earth being flat? What is gained by this?

Thanks, I'll take your answer off the air.

[Smackie Chan]

This thread has gone far longer than it reasonably should have, so let's try to put a few things to rest here. poptart has said about NASA:

They've spoon fed you bullshit, and spun bullshit children's tales for decades.

I would say the same thing about religion, specifically Christianity, which is essentially the spoon feeding of children's stories intended to explain the unexplainable based on a book (or collection of several books, if that makes you feel better) that religious organizers have declared is the word of God, when it's really just words of men. And then they try to use the collection of books to prove itself to be true, which, as mvscal so eloquently stated, is just sucking one's own dick.

But that's beside the point.

More to the point is that poptart has stated he's a keen observer of the world around him, and implores us all to be more observant. I've observed a thing or two in my day, among them being that people tend to seek out information that reinforces what they already believe. I've been guilty of it, as have all of us. If a source presents information contrary to what we believe, we try to discredit that source. When a source presents information that reinforces what we believe, we hold that source up as credible. Lots of that goin' on in this thread from both sides.

poptart has been unapologetic about his belief in the Bible, which even he would have to admit is based on faith, despite attempts to use science and history to make its claims seem credible. While it may seem needless, defining simple terms is called for in this discussion. Any dictionary will do - I used dictionary.com out of convenience. The following definitions come from there:

Faith: belief that is not based on proof
Proof: evidence sufficient to establish a thing as true, or to produce belief in its truth
Objective: not influenced by personal feelings, interpretations, or prejudice; based on facts; unbiased
Science: systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation

There's no need to justify or prove what one believes if that belief is faith-based. It can't be proven, by definition. Nor must it be objective. In fact, it must be subjective - it's subject to what one's faith dictates one believes. The goal of science is to determine what can be known without prejudice or bias - to prove what can be proven. When proof gets in the way of faith-based beliefs, the faithful willingly choose to discount the evidence used to establish proof using whatever information, however incredulous, is presented by anyone willing to put it forward.

Does that mean there is no incentive for scientists to introduce bias into their experiments and conclusions? Of course not. Money and reputation are strong motivators. But in many areas of study, there is more than sufficient evidence, sometimes gathered through unbiased observation and experimentation over centuries, to reasonably be accepted as proof. Simply accepting the overwhelming and unassailable (which aren't forceful enough words but will have to do) evidence of Earth's shape in no way "disproves" what the Bible states. Christian scholars and non-scholars throughout many centuries have accepted the fact that our planet is spherical without it shaking their faith.

You can, too, pops.

[Atomic Punk]

Jsc, that's the whole problem with pops. He believes in a literal interpretation of the Bible then loses credibility in scientific arguments. Pops doesn't understand science, nor the concept of metaphors let alone infinity.

[Felix]

poptart has been unapologetic about his belief in the Bible, which even he would have to admit is based on faith, despite attempts to use science and history to make its claims seem credible.

There's no need to justify or prove what one believes if that belief is faith-based.

zactly, pops doesn't need to apologize to anyone for his belief in the bible.....as I've said numerous times, I have a lot of admiration for tart because he is unwavering in his defense of the bible....it doesn't really matter what the rest of us think about his beliefs after all they are HIS BELIEFS and he's entitled to believe whatever he wants without having to apologize to anyone for holding those beliefs.....

while I know he's misguided in his belief that the earth is flat, he's not alone in holding that belief.....

the earth isn't round, it's flat

[Jay in Phoenix]

That's all well and fine Felix, unless we're talking about blind faith.

Nice band, bad ideology.

[poptart]

My snow globe analogy wasn't really off base at all

I understand the only book or historical document you believe is the bible.

You consult it for and apply your interpretation to all historical reference to your day to day existence

if science & physical evidence contradict it - then it is a hoax

My question then is ............ why?

Why would there be a worldwide conspiracy to keep masses ignorant?

is it some kind of "test" from God to cull the nonbelievers?

Oh, more questions...

DId you get around to watching the Buzz clip yet?
lol


Why the "conspiracy?"

You should take time to read my posts, guy.
That's why I type them.
And look at the videos and links.

If you don't, there is no point in me pursuing your whims.


Later...

[poptart]

you peddle myth as fact

There is a thing called faith, Smackie.
I've REPEATEDLY said that we Christians are called to have it.

I don't claim fact.
And as I've said over and over, I don't KNOW for sure what the shape of the earth is.
I have a hypothesis.


I claim what I observe - and what I have experienced.


Romans 1:22
Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools

[poptart]

what simple observation tells you it's not round? I have a friend of mine that pilots private jets that fly at extremely high altitutdes.....he tells me that when you get to about 45,000 feet (which is higher than any commercial airline will ever fly) you can actually see the curvature of the earth......that's pretty much a direct observation.....so what have you "observed" that would indicate the earth is not round? What is the shape of every other planet in our solar system? they are round and that can be confirmed by me by simply looking through my telescope at Venus, Saturn, Mars and Jupiter.....I own a telescope powerful enough to let me see those planets.......and I took a university astronomy class so I know how to locate each of the above named planets when I'm night sky watching.....every one of them is round and do you know why? it's this little thing called gravity.....the gravitational power of an object is related to it's size, atmosphere, etc. The moon's gravitational pull is significantly lower than the earths because it is considerably smaller......but the tides of the earth are controlled by the gravitational pull of the moon.......you can look into the sky with the naked eye and see the moon is a round ball like shape.....what makes you think the earth would be the only planet in our solar system that's not round? gravity determined the shape of planets when they began to form billions of years after the big bang......scientists believe the earth began to take shape after it collided with a similarly sized object......there were large enough pieces remaining in tact that gravitational pull started drawing them together to create a larger object which we now refer to as earth.....

Also does not read my posts...