Training Camp Issues

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:57 am

About two weeks 'til camp opens.

What are a couple/few areas of particular interest with your team?

Coming off of an other dismal season (4-12), Oakland obviously has a LOT of holes and question marks.

Three that quickly jump out at me are as follows:

1. Receiving Corp
Jerry Porter is gone and Javon Walker and Drew Carter are in.
Carter has been nothing special and Walker (our supposed #1) has had a couple big years, but injuries and knuckleheadery have plagued him.
Al paid through the nose for this guy and him getting the shit kicked out of him while actin' the fool in Vegas wasn't exactly what the doctor ordered.
Ronald Curry has been a decent player, but injuries have been a problem for him too.
The 'duds also have a handful of young names on the roster.
They BADLY need to have a couple of players emerge as big-time targets to help JaMarcus along.

2. The Trenches
The O-line did a real good job with run-blocking last year but had some struggles with pass protection.
Can Kwame Harris really do the job at LT?
Who is our RT?
I have a lot of confidence in T. Cable, and I look for the line to make more strides this year.
Defensively, the team was HORRIBLE v. the run last year.
Stu is gone (replaced by Gerbil Wilson) and that helps some.
But do we have enough up front, and particularly in the middle?
I'm very skeptical.
Watching this closely.

3. JaMarcus
He's really an advanced rookie, as he got very little field time last season.
But he's in shape and he's really been WITH the program all off-season.
It's 'his' team now, so to speak.
I look for our backs and TE's to see a lot of balls come their way.
Kiffin seems to want a 'possession' attack, quick drops and get the ball out of the QB's hand.
Keep the pass rush off the young guy.
High completion pct.
Gain confidence.
Occassional vertical ball.
I like.

I frankly can't wait for things to kick off.

Your team?

RumpleForeskin · Post by **RumpleForeskin** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:41 pm

Three things that will peak my interest:

1. Secondary
Dunta Robinson won't be ready until week 7 when he comes off the PUP list, so that will be a major + when he comes back with 10 games to go. As for the others, I am VERY interested in seeing the improvement in 2nd year man Fred Bennett. He has all the makings of a diamond in the rough (4th Round choice 2007) considering how well he played his rookie season. This kid will be the secondary's leader before Dunta comes back. As for the rest, well the I'm interested in seeing what Jacques Reeves can do to help this team and how DeMarcus Faggins will adjust to his role as a back up. As for the Safeties, well Earl is back and the Texans did sign veteran safety Nick Ferguson which does add some depth behind front men Will Demps and CC Brown. A lot of competition there.

2. The Running Man
Its safe to say that Ahman Green was pretty much a bust for the Texans in his first year as he was plagued by injuries for more than half the season. This forced the Texans to count on Ron Dayne quite a bit. Wihtout the explosive first step to get to the hole, I'd say the running game cost the Texans games against Atlanta and Indy early in the season. Green still remains as the number one, but with the additions of Chris Brown and Steve Slaton, it will be interesting to see how these guys compete in training camp. Also, you can't rule out Chris Taylor as that kid showed a lot of fight out there in OTAs.

3. Help the Superhero

Mario Williams proved to be one of the best DEs in the game last season nad has emerged as the front runner among the big three from that controversial draft in 2006. VY and Bush have some splaining to do. Super Mario is a superhero, but all superhero's need help from time to time. Superman needed Miss Teschmacher, Spiderman needed some pipe throwing NY civilians, so Mario needs someone like Valerie Perrine to offer a pass rush on the other side. Although I don't think Valerie is a good choice because she is 65 years old and has a dodgy knee. I want to see the progression in Amobi Okoye like what we saw in Mario when he entered camp his second year. Kubiak says he is seeing it from Okoye, so that is some positive news. Also, Rosevelt Colvin can be that guy too. I hope he has enough juice in the legs to give Houston what it needs on the front seven to have a consistent pass rush.

I've got the biggest

after typing this.

ChargerMike · Post by **ChargerMike** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 7:56 pm

...this just in of Hacksaw's high speed sports wire..Paul Hackett meeting with the Raiduhs today re. an offensive "helper" position...can't hurt, Hackett's a good man.

DallasFanatic · Post by **DallasFanatic** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 7:30 pm

Cowboys

1. Special Teams (tackling) - Losing Keith Davis sucks. Punting and field goal kicking should be fine
2. Third string QB - If we lose Romo, Johnson is a fingertouch from going down. After that we have Mr Bartel. That translates to a lost season.
3. Head Coach - Kinda sucks knowing if you don't make it deep into the playoffs, you're out of a job. Garrett is more than ready to take the reins, but I hate having a coach who's on a short leash.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 7:34 pm

Packers

1. Who is the starting quarterback?

2. Who is the starting quarterback?

3. Who is the starting quarterback?

Qbert · Post by **Qbert** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:39 am

fixed by ME.

please continue with "intellectule" discussions please.

Headhunter · Post by **Headhunter** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:32 pm

DallasFanatic wrote:Cowboys

1. Special Teams (tackling) - Losing Keith Davis sucks. Punting and field goal kicking should be fine
2. Third string QB - If we lose Romo, Johnson is a fingertouch from going down. After that we have Mr Bartel. That translates to a lost season.
3. Head Coach - Kinda sucks knowing if you don't make it deep into the playoffs, you're out of a job. Garrett is more than ready to take the reins, but I hate having a coach who's on a short leash.

I'd throw safety in there as well.

Sure, they are doing things to address the fact that Roy Williams can't cover shit with some overtures about moving Henry to safety on Dime, but it's a GLARING weakness on what should be a stellar defense.

And RB should be solid, but let's see how Tashard Choice and Felix Jones look before we just assume they're alright at the RB position.

RumpleForeskin · Post by **RumpleForeskin** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:01 pm

Tart, I'd like to say the Raiders are moving in the right direction, but like you mentioned, the o-line and d-line are still big concerns. I was really hoping the Raiders gave Burgess some help and drafted Gholston instead of McFadden, but that is all in the past.

I hope the Nation doesn't get the idea that McFadden will turn in a similar season that AP turned in last year for the Vikes. Different circumstances and a much better o-line IMO. Let him get his touches along with Bush and/or Fargas and things will happen. If the o-line can get the ground game to stick, then Russell should get some time to throw.

RumpleForeskin · Post by **RumpleForeskin** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:13 pm

I'd say Dallas' biggest concern is the front 7. Tank Johnson is good if he can stay out of trouble. From what I've heard, Johnson is poised for a great season as he is refocused on football. Spears and Canty can get to the QB enough, but the run defense was inconsistent at times and from what we saw, that front 7 wore down towards the end of the season.

I see the 'Boys have added some sick depth to an already sick secondary, but it's on the front 7 to have a solid rotation so those guys can stay fresh going into the postseason.

Cuda · Post by **Cuda** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:42 pm

Broncos:

Offense:
1. Insulin dependent, diabetic at QB
2. Rookie Left Tackle
3. Wife-beaters at RB & WR

Defense:

1. DL- what DL?
2. LB- what's a LB?
3. Secondary- Champ's a year older & Lynch should have retired a year ago

They'll be lucky to beat anybody besides the Chefs

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:47 pm

Rumps, even if McFadden is as good a player as A.P., which is a hell of a lot to live up to, I don't think he'll put up the kind of numbers that Peterson did last yr -- over 1,600 total yds, 13 TDs.

You called it by noting the great Vike O-line and the fact that J. Fargas figures to get a lot of carries for the Raiders.

I'm excited to see what McFadden can do, though, and I could easily have put the running back situation up as one of my areas of interest for training camp.

M. Bush is obviously an interest too.

ChargerMike · Post by **ChargerMike** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 6:51 pm

Cuda wrote:Broncos:

Offense:
1. Insulin dependent, diabetic at QB
2. Rookie Left Tackle
3. Wife-beaters at RB & WR

Defense:

1. DL- what DL?
2. LB- what's a LB?
3. Secondary- Champ's a year older & Lynch should have retired a year ago

They'll be lucky to beat anybody besides the Chefs

...ditto,

most other teams in the NFL

DallasFanatic · Post by **DallasFanatic** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:02 pm

RumpleForeskin wrote:I'd say Dallas' biggest concern is the front 7. Tank Johnson is good if he can stay out of trouble. From what I've heard, Johnson is poised for a great season as he is refocused on football. Spears and Canty can get to the QB enough, but the run defense was inconsistent at times and from what we saw, that front 7 wore down towards the end of the season.

I see the 'Boys have added some sick depth to an already sick secondary, but it's on the front 7 to have a solid rotation so those guys can stay fresh going into the postseason.

You sound like a fan that knows the game Rumps, so we both know the front seven and secondary go hand in hand. A great front seven can disguise an "ok" secondary with quick pressure and a great secondary can disguise an "ok" front seven yielding coverage sacks. However the Boys in the past have had pretty good front sevens, but the secondary has been the weak link. There will be no more Jacques Reeves being burnt (sorry he's your mess now) or Nate Jones looking lost. The Boys roll 4 sick corners to the defense to match up with high-profiled offenses. They just signed Hamlin, locking down the secondary for the next 4 or five years. This crap is scary.

I think this will have help improve sack numbers from the front seven. Ratliff shares time with Johnson at nose tackle and also helps Canty/Spears at defensive end. Ratliff is just a sick individual and needs to be on the field more. This defense reminds me of 92-94 all over again. Hopefully the end results will pan out the same

RumpleForeskin · Post by **RumpleForeskin** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:18 pm

I see your point, DF. Newman and Jones are lockdown guys and Hamlin just adds to that mix because we all know he can cover too. Mike Jenkins will need a role in order to develop.

You still got a wildcard in Jones. Being out of the game for a year might take him a little time to get those sick skills back. We'll see.

If they can spell the box men from having to make all the big plays, then I don't see why they can't stay fresh the entire season.

As for the Reeves comment, well dude was filling in for the injured group and still turned in a decent season. It's not like the 'Boys pass defense was atrocious when he stepped in. The thing I like about Reeves is he will get his nose dirty on run support which is nice to have in a backup corner.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Wed Jul 16, 2008 9:43 pm

McFadden has both more size and speed than Bush.

Not a real good comparison, IMO, however it may be true that McFadden, like Bush, won't be much of a 'between-the-tackles' runner.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 12:00 am

McFadden is 'not really' taller, heavier and faster than R. Bush?

Ok, thanks, your denial of reality is noted.

What kind of career the kid ends up having remains to be seen.

Your opinon is also noted.

RevLimiter · Post by **RevLimiter** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 1:26 am

Cuda wrote:Broncos:

Offense:
1. Insulin dependent, diabetic at QB
2. Rookie Left Tackle
3. Wife-beaters at RB & WR

Defense:

1. DL- what DL?
2. LB- what's a LB?
3. Secondary- Champ's a year older & Lynch should have retired a year ago

They'll be lucky to beat anybody besides the Chefs

Bring it on!

Sin,

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 1:48 am

NFL.com lists Bush as 6-0, 203 and McFadden as 6-2, 210.

Bush is 23 yrs old and has been in the league 2 yrs.
McFadden is 20 and is a rookie.
And we all know that players most typically GAIN weight from where they are when they come into the league.

McFadden is bigger and faster than Bush.

The end.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 2:23 am

poptart wrote: McFadden is bigger and faster than Bush.

Which will make him a great candidate for ESPN's "jacked up" feature. There are AFC West linebackers and safeties who are right now salivating at the thought.

Welcome to the NFL, rook.

RumpleForeskin · Post by **RumpleForeskin** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:02 am

Regardless of their size now, McFadden has the body type to add more bulk to his frame and be more like AP than Bush.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 2:32 pm

RumpleForeskin wrote:Regardless of their size now, McFadden has the body type to add more bulk to his frame and be more like AP than Bush.

So we can look forward to a picture of Darren McFadden in ladies’ bloomers sometime soon?

ChargerMike · Post by **ChargerMike** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:53 pm

RumpleForeskin wrote:Regardless of their size now, McFadden has the body type to add more bulk to his frame and be more like AP than Bush.

...I may be able to point the kid in the right direction..

"Lights out".

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:50 pm

Mvscal, you (and a couple of others) who have expressed the take that McFadden won't do shit at the NFL level are basing it on your ... hope, plain and simple.

Gimmick offense?? lol

Hey, fine, the guy put up over 4,000 yds rushing and 40 TDs in 3 years playing in the SEC.
The SEC.
The SEC.

It wasn't like he was a wishbone tailback playing in the WAC or some shit like that.

The kid showed durability and ... GAME, while playing in one of the elite conferences in the nation.

You can hope for his failure all you want, but don't pretend it's anything other than your hope, while pee is dripping down your leg.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:14 am

poptart wrote:Mvscal, you (and a couple of others) who have expressed the take that McFadden won't do shit at the NFL level are basing it on your ... hope, plain and simple.

Nope, I'm basing it on his performance in the 2008 Cotton Bowl where he got upstaged by Tony fucking Temple, who didn't even get drafted.

That's right, the great Heismann hopeful got his shit stuffed by Mizzou. You wanna' mention the SEC again?

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:23 am

McFadden had a tremendous college career, and was a 2x Heisman Trophy runner-up...yet you're basing your entire prediction of his future on the performance of one game? Sound reasoning. According to that logic, Tom Brady should've been drafted by a professional paper football team, not New England.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:39 am

All politics is mostly local. Tell me you knew.

How do you dismiss that one game, btw? That was his last one. 'tart wanted to prop the SEC, but what happened against a team not from the SEC? And how does that translate into NFL success?

Stupid fucking draft pick, bottom line.

RevLimiter · Post by **RevLimiter** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:57 am

War Wagon wrote:
poptart wrote:Mvscal, you (and a couple of others) who have expressed the take that McFadden won't do shit at the NFL level are basing it on your ... hope, plain and simple.
Nope, I'm basing it on his performance in the 2008 Cotton Bowl where he got upstaged by Tony fucking Temple, who didn't even get drafted.

That's right, the great Heismann hopeful got his shit stuffed by Mizzou. You wanna' mention the SEC again?

Gotta side with Pops here....McFadden got "upstaged" by Tony Temple ONLY because he didn't wanna get hurt and fuck up his draft position, and if you recall Arkansas was coached by a fill-in (as if those players were going to do ANYTHING that guy wanted them to do).

McFadden almost single-handedly ran roughshod through LSU's vaunted D in their last regular season game, so feel free to save all this bullshit about him being a "bust".

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:03 am

War Wagon wrote:How do you dismiss that one game, btw?

Because I'm willing to bet that around 100% of all NFL starters have had at least one bad game in college.

That was his last one. 'tart wanted to prop the SEC, but what happened against a team not from the SEC? And how does that translate into NFL success?

I'll admit I didn't see the game, and so I can't judge that particular performance. I did see him play quite a bit though in other games involving stout competition, and the guy looked to be a freak of nature. He's got all the tools the NFL looks for. If he turns out to be a bust I'll be shocked to say the least.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:06 am

RevLimiter wrote: McFadden got "upstaged" by Tony Temple ONLY because he didn't wanna get hurt and fuck up his draft position...

right.

So we can add "sand bagging cunt" to his resume. That's sure to garner rave reviews from his teammates.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:12 am

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:If he turns out to be a bust I'll be shocked to say the least.

Mgo... we might have an opening in the JAFFL.

We'll keep your name in mind.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:20 am

Thanks, Wags. Got any more brilliant displays of reasoning you'd like sashay us with? Peyton Manning had 130-some yards passing in his last CFB game, a game in which UT was utterly destroyed. How'd his NFL career work out for him?

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:40 am

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:Got any more brilliant displays of reasoning you'd like sashay us with?

sashay us? You're like a fish out of water.

Peyton Manning had 130-some yards passing in his last CFB game, a game in which UT was utterly destroyed.

You're comparing McFadden to Peyton Manning?

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:53 am

sashay us? You're like a fish out of water.

Really? I'm apparently dealing with one of the forum's best and brightest right now, yet I oddly feel like a great white to your minnow.

You're comparing McFadden to Peyton Manning?

Honestly? THAT'S what you concluded, and NOT that I was shooting a hole in your shoddy logic? Fucking...WOW.

I'll break this down rrrreal easy for you:

1) Your entire argument revolved around a performance based on a player's "last game"
2) I cited an example in which a player's "last game" still led to a successful NFL career

Get it now?

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 3:09 am

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote: Your entire argument revolved around a performance based on a player's "last game"

There are many other arguments, like him being a gangbanging punk, but I choose to use the argument most readily available... what he did against a real defense in his last game.

I cited an example in which a player's "last game" still led to a successful NFL career

You compared apples to bananas, that's what you did, and I remain unimpressed.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:04 am

Wagon, the reason that you trotted out as your ... #1 reason ... why McFadden will suck is just plain silly.
Barely worth responding to.
One game does not define a career and especially when the guy in question has been an utterly DOMINANT player.
That was Mgo's point in bringing up Manning's last collegiate game dud.

If you want to say McFadden will fail because he's a low-character guy, it might have some wings.
He has some 'questionable' history on his resume.

Shitcan the 'one bad game' rhetoric because the thinking people on this board are giggling and shaking their head horizontally at your take.

RumpleForeskin · Post by **RumpleForeskin** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:24 pm

poptart wrote:~~Barely~~ Not worth responding to.

FTFY

I read it last night and about had a coronary from all the laughter.

Based on Whitey's logic, everyone will be a bust in the NFL.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:53 pm

poptart wrote:If you want to say McFadden will fail because he's a low-character guy, it might have some wings.
He has some 'questionable' history on his resume.

Well, that certainly doesn't stop NFL talent from producing on the field as far as I can tell.

My prediction is that McFadden will be dedicated to playing the game and winning. Certainly he did just that at Arkansas, so I have nothing different to go by. Whitey's just pulling more non-sensical bullshit out of his ass, because he wants to see a Raider draftee fail. That's all there is to it.

RumpleForeskin · Post by **RumpleForeskin** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:03 pm

Let us not forget the supporting cast McFadden has in the backfield with him.

Fargas and Bush can keep McFadden fresh and explosive in the 2nd half of games where defenses usually lose a step.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:11 pm

RumpleForeskin wrote: Based on Whitey's logic, everyone will be a bust in the NFL.

Tony Temple won't. :wink:

But y'all feel free to get back with me when McFadden flames out spectacularly. I won't say I told you so, much.

Conversely, If he's the next coming of Gale Sayers, I'll be the 1st one to admit I was wrong.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Jul 18, 2008 4:09 pm

McFadden has absolutely no experience with an even remotely pro-style offense

Just like a lot of college players going into the NFL. That's why they have these things called "coaches" to teach and train players how to play in the NFL.