Justices uphold welfare home searches

[Cuda]

Let me get this straight... the 9th Cirsuit is supposed to be reeeeeely liberal, right?

Yet they say it's totally ok to make certain mvscals give up their 4th Amendment protections because they're recipients of tax money.

Kinda makes one think the left is being disingenuous on the warrantless eavesdropping thingie, doesn't it?

Oh, wait... when the Left does it, that makes it OK.

Bode Nixon.

[Moving Sale]

Is this a good decision? Or does it set a bad precedent?

It's not like your brain dead ass can answer your own damn question.
~~~~~~

Yet they say it's totally ok to make certain mvscals give up their 4th Amendment protections because they're recipients of tax money.

That's right It’s all the LIBs fault. Do you EVER get tired of being a tool?

BTW- If they don't want to be searched this way they may want to get new housing.

[Mikey]

Let me get this straight... the 9th Cirsuit is supposed to be reeeeeely liberal, right?

Yet they say it's totally ok to make certain mvscals give up their 4th Amendment protections because they're recipients of tax money.

Kinda makes one think the left is being disingenuous on the warrantless eavesdropping thingie, doesn't it?

Oh, wait... when the Left does it, that makes it OK.

Bode Nixon.

Your logic is imperceptible.

[Mister Bushice]

WASHINGTON - The Supreme Court rejected a challenge today to San Diego County's practice of routinely searching welfare applicants' homes without warrants and ruling out assistance for those who refuse to let them in.

The justices refused, without comment, to intervene in the case from San Diego County, where investigators from the District Attorney's Office show up unannounced at applicants' homes and conduct searches that include peeking into closets and cabinets. The visits do not require any suspicion of fraud and are intended to confirm that people are eligible for government aid.

Failure to submit to the searches, which can last an hour, disqualifies applicants from assistance.

The 10-year-old program was challenged by the American Civil Liberties Union on behalf of six single parents who were seeking assistance. The welfare applicants argued that the Fourth Amendment, which prohibits unreasonable searches, protects them from the home visits.

Link to news article

From the 9th Circuit Opinion:

In 1997, the San Diego County District Attorney (“D.A.”) initiated a program whereby all San Diego County residents who submit welfare applications under California’s welfare program (“CalWORKS”), and are not suspected of fraud or ineligibility, are automatically enrolled in Project 100%. The parties are essentially in agreement as to the structure and operation of Project 100%. Under Project 100%, all applicants receive a home visit from an investigator employed by the D.A.’s office. The visit includes a “walk through” to gather eligibility information that is then turned over to eligibility technicians who compare that information with information supplied by the applicant. Specifically, the investigator views items confirming that: (1) the applicant has the amount of assets claimed; (2) the applicant has an eligible dependent child; (3) the applicant lives in California; and (4) an “absent” parent does not live in the residence.

When applicants submit an application for welfare benefits, they are informed that they will be subject to a mandatory home visit in order to verify their eligibility. Applicants are also informed that the home visit must be completed prior to aid being granted, but are not given notice of the exact date and time the visit will occur. The visits are generally made within 10 days of receipt of the application and during regular business hours, unless a different time is required to accommodate an applicant’s schedule. The home visits are conducted by investigators from the Public Assistance Fraud Division of the D.A.’s office, who are sworn peace officers with badges and photo identification. The investigators wear plain clothes and do not carry weapons.

The actual home visit consists of two parts: an interview with the applicant regarding information submitted during the intake process, and a “walk through” of the home. The visit takes anywhere from 15 minutes to an hour, with five to 10 minutes generally allocated to the “walk through.” If the applicant refuses to allow a home visit, the investigator immediately terminates the visit and reports that the applicant failed to cooperate. This generally results in the denial of benefits.1 The denial of welfare aid is the only consequence of refusing to allow the home visit; no criminal or other sanctions are imposed for refusing consent.

The “walk through” portion of the home visit is also conducted with the applicant’s consent. The applicant is asked to lead the “walk through” and the investigator is trained to look for items in plain view. The investigator will also ask the applicant to view the interior of closets and cabinets, but will only do so with the applicant’s express permission.2 While the investigators are required to report evidence of potential criminal wrongdoing for further investigation and prosecution, there is no evidence that any criminal prosecutions for welfare fraud have stemmed from inconsistencies uncovered during a Project 100% home visit.3

Link to 9th Circuit decision

Is this a good decision? Or does it set a bad precedent?

Dude, drop the greasy lawyer cloak and think like a hard working taxpayer who supports those who aren't working then roll in the concept of checks and balances the framers of the constitution employed.

WTF do you think?

[Dinsdale]

You accept government assistance, you accept government policies.

Did anyone ever think they'd see the day when mvscal was crowned King of the Liberals?


Because he's right there in lock-step with the NeoLibs.


Gee, and here I was, thinking that the 4th Amendment WAS a "government policy"... but I'd forgotten that the Liberal Revolution tookover the country over the last 6 years.

[Dinsdale]

Where will it end?

When Big Government gets out of the socialism business.


Vote Ron Paul, the only conservative presidential candidate.

[Goober McTuber]

There are lots of federal aid programs besides welfare, anyone you know have a home loan with the Federal Housing Administration? Question: if it is ok to search welfare homes without a warrant, then is it also ok to search FHA homes without a warrant? What about corporations who receive public assistance, could they be subject to warrantless searches? What if you get Social Security? Medicare?

Where will it end?

[RumpleForeskin]

Judge Ted Poe despised these people and instead of sending them to prison for the extended sentences, he would reduce the sentence and humiliate those fucking criminals to no end.

[Cuda]

Do you EVER get tired of being a tool?

If by "tool" you mean "Give that faggot TVO every opportunity to look like an ass", then, no, I never get tired of that

BTW- If they don't want to be searched this way they may want to get new housing.

So you're in favor of the Patriot Act as well, right?

[Mister Bushice]

There are lots of federal aid programs besides welfare,

But they aren't subject to as high a potential level of abuse as Welfare is.

anyone you know have a home loan with the Federal Housing Administration?

No, but I''ll bet those who apply are put through a much more thorough application process, which should be reviewable if they no longer qualify.

Question: if it is ok to search welfare homes without a warrant, then is it also ok to search FHA homes without a warrant?

As long as the requirements up front state that inspections will be done, it isn't a search and it warrantless

What about corporations who receive public assistance, could they be subject to warrantless searches?

They certainly should be reviewed / audited on a regular basis. A search would not necessarily accomplish much.

What if you get Social Security? Medicare?

Given the pitiful level of social security money doled out to the average retired person, which is based on tax returns filed and a life time of paying into it, this system is hardly subject to the kind of abuse Welfare is.

and Medicare is a last resort for most people, but given the fucked up state of health care in this country, they could do warrant less searches all they want and get nowhere.

[BBMarley]

Fuck 'em.. every one.

Last week I stopped at the Acme to pick up some stuff on my way home from work. There were 4 Mexicans in front of me that had all their shit separated into two piles- wasn't sure why. First pile was done- and they pulled out the government food stamps to pay for it. Then they pulled out a knot of bills as big as my fist to pay for the rest... presumably because the food stamps didn't cover that shit.

So- fuck them. They are getting government assistance like this- the government has every right to make sure they actually deserve it and are using it properly

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

When big business is given "corporate welfare", should their offices be searched without warrants?

[Mikey]

Last week I stopped at the Acme

Were you there to get the anvil, the rocket powered roller skates, the big spring loaded boxing glove, or just some acid laced bird seed?

[Mister Bushice]

Fuck 'em.. every one.

Last week I stopped at the Acme to pick up some stuff on my way home from work. There were 4 Mexicans in front of me that had all their shit separated into two piles- wasn't sure why. First pile was done- and they pulled out the government food stamps to pay for it. Then they pulled out a knot of bills as big as my fist to pay for the rest... presumably because the food stamps didn't cover that shit.

So- fuck them. They are getting government assistance like this- the government has every right to make sure they actually deserve it and are using it properly

It's the ones who load up on milk, cheese, etc with WIC coupons, then go out into the parking lot and get into their 2006 Sequoias that bug the shit out of me, or the lady who stood in front of me last year before thanksgiving, bought a meal for 6 consisting mostly of junk food with food stamps then unrolled cash for a couple of cartons of cigs and a big expensive bottle of booze.

[Dinsdale]

Yet you people won't denounce socialism when you step into that voting booth.


If you don't demand better, you'll never get anything better.


Fucking tards.

[Mister Bushice]

like it fucking matters who we vote for. The choices sucked the last two times, and they'll suck again this time.

[Dinsdale]

like it fucking matters who we vote for.

Chicken or egg, tard?

Yeah, it certainly does matter... as evidenced by the mad rush towards socialism.

You (meaning everyone) voted in socialists. When it came time to reelect, your uninformed asses didn't hold them accountable, and you let them further promote the socialist agenda.

And now, there's a presidential candidate that wants to end socialism and Big Government. Where's the problem?


Socialism = Theft


I just hope the socialism YOU PEOPLE embrace doesn't start the dreaded "domino effect."

[Mikey]

The pancake on the head thing should give you an idea.

[Dinsdale]

I'm not worked up about a candidate. I'm worked up over the March to Socialism.

If you'll remember, tens of thousands of Americans died fighting wars to stop the spread of communism/socialism... now Americans embrace it.

I guess I am kind of worked up that one candidate wants to reverse the socialism(theft) trend, yet people seem to want the same old, same old theft, when a step in the right direction is within their grasp.

But hey, look at France. They embraced socialism. They let immigration go unchecked, and let those immigrants isolate, rather than assimilate... and there you have it. The blueprint for disaster has been drawn, and you people can't emulate it fast enough.

[Dinsdale]

Way to go, tards.

PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) - U.S. Ron Wyden, D-Ore., said he plans to introduce legislation that would direct the Federal Reserve to create a rating system for credit cards.

The highest-risk cards, such as those that allow the issuing bank to raise the interest rate at any time without stating a reason, would receive one star. The lowest-risk cards would get five stars.

At a news conference at Portland State University, Wyden noted that that U.S. households had an average of $6,900 in credit card debt at the end of September, an increase of 41 percent from a year earlier.

"These credit card debts are hitting Oregon families like a wrecking ball," he said Tuesday.

Wyden said he and U.S. Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., will introduce the legislation next week. He said the system would give consumers a way to judge the riskiness of a credit-card offer without having to plow through all that fine print.

Yup... you people even need Big Government to remove the "thinking for yourself" part from signing a legally-binding contract.


Yes, you did read that right -- the Fed wants to make it so you don't have to read the fine print on a contract.

Coupla issues:

First and foremost, someone wanna point out which part of Article 1 grants Congress the right to create a "credit card rating system"? Someone link a brother up.


Second -- How can this even be happening? How did things get this bad this quickly? Big Government is actually promoting stupidity. There's a centuries-old proverb that states "A fool and his money are soon parted." Hundreds of years later, it's still absolutely true. And no amount of legislation is ever going to change that... BUT, they can sure pass legislation to promote it... like encouraging people to not read contracts they sign, and to not educate themselves about things like variable interest rates, and other things that can have a profound æffect on their family's well-being.


Why is having The People thinking for themselves, and educating themselves on important day-to-day issues such a bad thing?


Why the trend to have people like Barackbama and Ron Whineden do your thinking for you, and charging you exhorbitant fees to do so(since they do such a good job of it)? I think everyone is better off if they actually decide FOR THEMSELVES what's best for them and their family. Hell, I seriously doubt Wyden or Obama know the forst thing about your family, and odds are they've never met your family... so why should they be making decisions for your family, while charging you an arm and a leg to do so? I mean sure, you people(posters on this board) have proven yourselves to be mentally-deficient feebs of the highest order time and time again, but I still think that evenm with your predeliction to idiocy, you''re still in a better position to make the best decisions for your family and yourselves... not some corrupt politician that merely needs to vote himself a pay raise when his family needs a new car.


Damn, why is it so hard to see how badly you're getting worked right now? Hell, you bought into a bunch of tardspeak from oil-barons who decided it was an absolute emergency for American safety to go attack a country with no air force, no navy, no weapons that could reack past the battlefield in front of them, and little armed forces to speak of...


Hello?



Stop stealing from me, you fucking thieves.

[Dinsdale]

Hey... don't throw down that vote in the primaries yet -- I've found a perfect candidate for you guys...

BATTLE GROUND, Wash. - A man accused of stealing thousands of dollars from his church has been elected to office in Battle Ground.

Art Nelson faces 12 counts of theft and will go to trial on Dec. 19. Members of Grace Fellowship in Ridgefield, where Nelson was a deacon, claim he wrote himself thousands of dollars worth of checks that were actually meant for charity.

On Tuesday, the final election results were tallied and Nelson came out on top in his bid for a seat on the Battle Ground City Council over competitor Tom Schultz.

KATU News called Nelson and told him he had won the election, but he refused to speak to us. He claims we are biased and have never asked him for his side of the story, even though he does admit that we have called and stopped by his home multiple times.

If Nelson is convicted of a felony, he cannot hold office.

I think that if more politicians would just cut to the chase and stick the money directly in their pocket, it would be good for the economy... it would cut out a lot of the red tape that they currently have to fight through to accomplish the same net result.

[Mikey]

Calm down Dins. Really. Take a red or something. You're gonna stroke out if you're not careful.

Did you consider the possibility that a rating system might actually encourage some people to read the fine print? ....as in "gee this one only gets one star maybe I should read the fine print before selling my soul to the Bank of Ukraine".

[BSmack]

Calm down Dins. Really. Take a red or something.

I should have taken the BLUE PILL.

sin

Dins

[Dinsdale]

Did you consider the possibility that a rating system might actually encourage some people to read the fine print?

Are you fucking retarded?

Let's see -- someone is willing to sign a legally-binding contract involving a lot of money without reading the fine print. But then the Big Government says "It's OK -- we already read the fine print for you, and decided which credit card is best for your family."


And this is supposed to encourage people who aren't smart enough to read fine print on contracts they sign to suddenly do so?



Seriously?


If you believe that -- I've got a half ounce I'll sell you for $400.


And hello? The government is now in the business(and don't fool yourselves, it's a "business") of recommending certain cards over others? Gee... no atmospere for rampant corruption there or anything. Hmmm... I wonder if they'll give Citibank a 5-star rating, after Abu Dhabi (which owns a huge chunk of Citi) donates millions of dollars to certain committee members' campaign funds?


Nahhhhhhh, that would never happen.

[poptart]

Dins why are you so worked up over a fringe candidate who will get less than 3%?

Paul will do well in both Iowa and NH.
After that happens, like magic, those '3%' polls that have been trotted out for us to look at will suddenly take a significant spike UPWARD for him.

[XXXL]

I'm not buying into it.......