profootballtalk.com reporting that Art Shell will be fired

BSmack · Post by **BSmack** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 6:56 pm

Well that wasn't exactly the return to the Raider Way that Davis promised this summer.

Raydah James · Post by **Raydah James** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:01 pm

RACK

Horrible. Fucking. Coach.

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:20 pm

BSmack wrote:Well that wasn't exactly the return to the Raider Way that Davis promised this summer.

What's going on with Cowher? I'm reading all kinds of grist from the internet rumor mill about he leaving for Miami. or even possibly (if Fox is canned) to Carolina.

BSmack · Post by **BSmack** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:36 pm

drummer wrote:
BSmack wrote:Well that wasn't exactly the return to the Raider Way that Davis promised this summer.
What's going on with Cowher? I'm reading all kinds of grist from the internet rumor mill about he leaving for Miami. or even possibly (if Fox is canned) to Carolina.

The only thing certain about Cowher is that unless the Rooneys drop a mountain of cash on him this weekend, he's gone.

As for the Cowher to Miami rumors, if the Steelers are given the level of compensation demanded and received for Gruden, I'd be all for it. For some reason the Pittsburgh papers have bitten on the Cowher to Miami rumor. But I'm thinking that a year long R&R in North Carolina and some light TV commentary duty would lead to Cowher breaking the bank with Dan Snyder in 08. Also, I'm hearing that Miami's current GM is very friendly with Bill Parcells. Who I'm sure has 25 million reasons to get away from "the player".

Cicero · Post by **Cicero** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:41 pm

^^^ Are you saying you want Gruden and that the Steelers would be interested??

If that's the case, then he is yours. Take him, please. Tampa will rejoice.

BSmack · Post by **BSmack** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:44 pm

Cicero wrote:^^^ Are you saying you want Gruden and that the Steelers would be interested??

If that's the case, then he is yours. Take him, please. Tampa will rejoice.

Not even close. I would want the deal the Raiders got for letting Gruden go to let Cowher go to Miami. I'm damn sure the Steelers would figure out a better way to use 2 1st round picks than the Raiders did.

The Assassin · Post by **The Assassin** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 10:22 pm

I predict it will be months before a coach is hired. Because honestly who in their right mind will take this job in the state this team is in?

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 11:26 pm

Well, it's almost 3:30 Pacific Time, and still no word of Shell getting canned.

Maybe Davis is pulling the media's chain?

I've looked at several other sites and forums, and nothing yet either.

PFT does jump the rumor gun at times.

edit: There is also no denial of the rumor either.

Mississippi Neck · Post by **Mississippi Neck** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 1:39 am

BSmack wrote:
drummer wrote:
BSmack wrote:Well that wasn't exactly the return to the Raider Way that Davis promised this summer.
What's going on with Cowher? I'm reading all kinds of grist from the internet rumor mill about he leaving for Miami. or even possibly (if Fox is canned) to Carolina.
The only thing certain about Cowher is that unless the Rooneys drop a mountain of cash on him this weekend, he's gone.

As for the Cowher to Miami rumors, if the Steelers are given the level of compensation demanded and received for Gruden, I'd be all for it. For some reason the Pittsburgh papers have bitten on the Cowher to Miami rumor. But I'm thinking that a year long R&R in North Carolina and some light TV commentary duty would lead to Cowher breaking the bank with Dan Snyder in 08. Also, I'm hearing that Miami's current GM is very friendly with Bill Parcells. Who I'm sure has 25 million reasons to get away from "the player".

Perhaps Cowher could sit out a year and go to Dallas if Parcells retires.

The Assassin · Post by **The Assassin** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 2:13 am

ESPN News is confirming it.

Mal · Post by **Mal** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 2:25 am

A mercy canning if ever there was one.

I'll give Shell limited props for taking the job when nobody else would but in all reality he was an abomination as a HC.

Nothing like taking over a garbage team and reducing them to a festering cowshit level.

Incidently great job with the O line Art.

Speculation is that Rob Ryan will be promoted but I doubt it.

Al tends to favor offensive types with his head coaching choices.

Either way addition by subtraction, even if we are stuck with the Mike Shermans of the world as candidates just getting Shell, Walsh and that entire losers mentality out of here is a plus.

We don't just need a talent upgrade, we need an culture change. The organization is in chaos and I for one am glad, it's the only way this crap is gonna change.

Blow it up, start over.

Hopefully this is the first step.

Let the games begin......

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 3:16 am

What does "fired" mean?

Sincerely,
the Ford family

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 4:25 am

The Assassin wrote:I predict it will be months before a coach is hired. Because honestly who in their right mind will take this job in the state this team is in?

It actually might be a real good time for a coach to jump and head the ship.

A budding defense that can be good for a few years to come.
High draft position, and lots of picks at your disposal.
Al in poor health (allegedly) and perhaps ready to step back a bit.

A coach might have a chance to put his stamp on the team for a change.

Also, there's nowhere to go but up.

I don't think it'll be Ryan either, Mal.

Maybe I'm just hopeful, but I'm going to predict that a pretty solid 'name' coach will land the Raider gig.

We'll see.

The Assassin · Post by **The Assassin** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:15 am

poptart wrote:
The Assassin wrote:I predict it will be months before a coach is hired. Because honestly who in their right mind will take this job in the state this team is in?
It actually might be a real good time for a coach to jump and head the ship.

A budding defense that can be good for a few years to come.
High draft position, and lots of picks at your disposal.
Al in poor health (allegedly) and perhaps ready to step back a bit.

A coach might have a chance to put his stamp on the team for a change.

Also, there's nowhere to go but up.

I don't think it'll be Ryan either, Mal.

Maybe I'm just hopeful, but I'm going to predict that a pretty solid 'name' coach will land the Raider gig.

We'll see.

Think Bernard Petrino this time around would be interested? Al gives him more control,lets him "buy the groceries" and quits bellowing those tired catchphrases? If I'm Petrino I'd be more willing to listen to Al this time.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:19 am

I believe he's the kind of guy Oakland needs.

I want Petrino.

.... not sexually.

The Assassin · Post by **The Assassin** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:21 am

poptart wrote:I believe he's the kind of guy Oakland needs.

I want Petrino.

.... not sexually.

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:42 am

poptart wrote:I believe he's the kind of guy Oakland needs.

I want Petrino.

.... not sexually.

I would think Martz would be an interesting choice, even though he wasn't really a consideration much when he interviewed last season, and you do have the defense, so Martz can't fuck that up much, and Martz won't be having any control of the drafts, so you're safe there, but.......

The Raiders don't have the line to implement Martz's offensive scheme. Warner and Bulger were getting killed in it. I dunno how DET manages, but he isn't the HC there either. DET fan could give you a better idea, I suppose.

Come to think of it, I don't think Martz can fix that offense that quick, and I dunno if he can build one from scratch either.

Fuck it, Glanville it is.

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 7:39 am

I still don't see why Davis doesn't call upon Ron Wolf to help him here. I dunno if they had a falling out due to egos, or whatever. Wolf can fix this mess. They only really have to key in on offense.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:17 am

I'm hearing 'rumor' that Rob Ryan will be named Oakland's new head coach.
It doesn't thrill me.
As an important side issue, if Ryan is promoted we have just lost our D-coordinator .... and a pretty good one.
He has to be replaced.

I'd prefer to see an energetic 'outsider' get the head coaching job.

I think someone who is already on-board will be more likely to end up on Al's puppet strings than someone from outside.

ChargerMike · Post by **ChargerMike** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 6:13 pm

Hater Nation:

Nice Hire, Guys

Art Shell is out as Raiders coach, just one season in his bid to "return the nastiness back to the Raiders." Remember all of that nonsense? Some of the quotes are just great. Here is a look down memory lane.

Al Davis: "It may take us a short while, but we'll get that nastiness of the Raiders back." How did that work out for you? It is kind of hard to be nasty when you coach looks as wooden as a cigar store Indian.

Art Shell: "I just want to get back to the point where when we walk into a stadium, they know the Raiders are in town." Yeah, they knew you were back in town because your team would leave with a victory.

And don't forget about the fans who bought into the whole,"Return to greatness" thing. Many thought it was blasphemy to suggest that Shell was going to be a bigger failure this time around. Many of them called us out in the FanHouse pages for basically telling them that failure was inevitable. You have to wonder how they are feeling now.

Now, many of you are likely sad to see Shell go, for fear that the Raiders will hire a competent coach. Don't hold your breath. If anything, the coaching search should again provide for more comedy as all of the big-name coaches turn down Davis' courting. Hell, you can imagine the legion of Raiders fans who are probably deluded into thinking that Bill Cowher is going to be the next Raiders coach.

If anything, watch for this coaching search to stretch near the scouting combine (again), until Davis settles for the cheapest alternative. And once again, you will hear all of the hyperbole about the "Return to greatness and the nastiness of the Raiders."

DallasFanatic · Post by **DallasFanatic** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:41 pm

Just heard on KLAC that Marc Tressman is meeting with Al today. I guess he was the OC who guided you to the SB in 02.

Don't know much about this guy but he is the one that called Al Davis and said he was interested. Sounds like a crazy sumbitch to me.

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:45 pm

DallasFanatic wrote:Just heard on KLAC that Marc Tressman is meeting with Al today. I guess he was the OC who guided you to the SB in 02.

Don't know much about this guy but he is the one that called Al Davis and said he was interested. Sounds like a crazy sumbitch to me.

We hated Trestman in SF when he was OC.

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:55 pm

Shell wasn't fired....

he "stepped down"......

BSmack · Post by **BSmack** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:00 pm

Felix wrote:Shell wasn't fired....

he "stepped down"......

That's what most guys who walk the plank do.

Raydah James · Post by **Raydah James** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:05 pm

drummer wrote:
DallasFanatic wrote:Just heard on KLAC that Marc Tressman is meeting with Al today. I guess he was the OC who guided you to the SB in 02.

Don't know much about this guy but he is the one that called Al Davis and said he was interested. Sounds like a crazy sumbitch to me.
We hated Trestman in SF when he was OC.

Elaborate.

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:32 pm

Raydah James wrote:
drummer wrote:
DallasFanatic wrote:Just heard on KLAC that Marc Tressman is meeting with Al today. I guess he was the OC who guided you to the SB in 02.

Don't know much about this guy but he is the one that called Al Davis and said he was interested. Sounds like a crazy sumbitch to me.
We hated Trestman in SF when he was OC.
Elaborate.

I think we he was first hired after Shanahan left, he wasn't in football for a few years prior. He was touted by Policy as a genius, but Trestman also came in after Ricky Watters left, who was a big part of the offense then.

His offense then wasn't very dynamic to me. The 49ers put up points, but they weren't the machine they were with previous OCs like Holmgren, and Shanahan. There were games I watched that made me scratch my head at the playcalling when Trestman was there.

When Mooch was brought in, during the press conference, a reporter asked both Policy and DeBartolo, what was Trestman's status with the team.

DeBartolo grabbed the mic, and said "GONE" . That was it. Mooch was originally brought in to be the new OC, but, Seifert saw it as a move to groom Mooch to HC for the future, and so he stepped down. Mooch was basically brought in to beat Green Bay, who owned the 49ers then, and still.

The bottom line was this: if Shanahan didn't leave for the Broncos and stayed with the 49ers, they could have been to another Super Bowl, and won it, regardless of losing Watters. Trestman then was a bad hire. Now, who knows.

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:41 pm

To add: I think Trestman really wanted the Raider job back before Turner was hired, but wasn't really much of a consideration then.

Raydah James · Post by **Raydah James** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 11:46 pm

KC Paul 3.0 wrote:
drummer wrote:
DallasFanatic wrote:Just heard on KLAC that Marc Tressman is meeting with Al today. I guess he was the OC who guided you to the SB in 02.

Don't know much about this guy but he is the one that called Al Davis and said he was interested. Sounds like a crazy sumbitch to me.
We hated Trestman in SF when he was OC.
Sounds like the next HC of the Raydahs to me....

At this juncture, he is a very good hire for the OC position.

Trestman always had a very solid gameplan and our offense scored alot of points during his tenure-i'd be fine with his hire as an offensive coordinator.

I've heard Dennis Greens name mentioned as a possible Head Coach candidate as well.......probably due to the fact that he drafted and coached Randy Moss during his most productive years, and is a "friend" of the Daywalker.

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 12:04 am

Raydah James wrote:
KC Paul 3.0 wrote:
drummer wrote: We hated Trestman in SF when he was OC.
Sounds like the next HC of the Raydahs to me....
At this juncture, he is a very good hire for the OC position.

Trestman always had a very solid gameplan and our offense scored alot of points during his tenure-i'd be fine with his hire as an offensive coordinator.

I've heard Dennis Greens name mentioned as a possible Head Coach candidate as well.......probably due to the fact that he drafted and coached Randy Moss during his most productive years, and is a "friend" of the Daywalker.

Wasn't Trestman essentially using Gruden's playbook in 2002?

In 2003, the team went 4-12. Gannon was hurt most of that season, but still, Oakland was ranked 27th in offense that season.

Trestman has had an up and down career, with a break from football to practice law :

2005-2006 Offensive Coordinator & Quarterback Coach NC State
2004 Quarterback Coach & Assistant Head Coach Miami Dolphins
2002-2003 Offensive Coordinator & Quarterback Coach Oakland Raiders
2001 Assistant Coach Oakland Raiders
1998-2000 Offensive Coordinator & Quarterback Coach Arizona Cardinals
1997 Quarterback Coach Detroit Lions
1995 Offensive Coordinator & Quarterback Coach San Francisco 49ers
1990-1991 Quarterback Coach Minnesota Vikings
1989 Offensive Coordinator & Quarterback Coach Cleveland Browns
1988 Quarterback Coach Cleveland Browns
1987 Quarterback Coach Tampa Bay Buccaneers
1985-1986 Running Backs Coach Minnesota Vikings
1983-1984 Quarterback Coach Miami-FL

I dunno, he seems like a mediocre HC candidate to me.

Raydah James · Post by **Raydah James** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 12:11 am

mvscal wrote:
Raydah James wrote:Trestman always had a very solid gameplan and our offense scored alot of points during his tenure-i'd be fine with his hire as an offensive coordinator.

I've heard Dennis Greens name mentioned as a possible Head Coach candidate as well.......

What better way to restore credibility than to hire coaches fired by the Cardinals?

I wouldnt touch that clown with a 10 foot pole-then again, I wouldnt have drafted a fucking kicker in the first round either.

Things could always be worse-like having Marty Shottenheimlich as a head coach.

Speaking of OC's: How soon before Marty's kid becomes the bolts OC after Cameron bounces out to a better job after another one and done playoff choke?

Raydah James · Post by **Raydah James** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 12:23 am

drummer wrote:
Raydah James wrote:
KC Paul 3.0 wrote: Sounds like the next HC of the Raydahs to me....
At this juncture, he is a very good hire for the OC position.

Trestman always had a very solid gameplan and our offense scored alot of points during his tenure-i'd be fine with his hire as an offensive coordinator.

I've heard Dennis Greens name mentioned as a possible Head Coach candidate as well.......probably due to the fact that he drafted and coached Randy Moss during his most productive years, and is a "friend" of the Daywalker.
Wasn't Trestman essentially using Gruden's playbook in 2002?

Yes, he used a "streamlined" version of it (Thanks to bill callahan, who made it pass heavy) that included a ton of timing/quick release on a 3 step drop passes.

I could talk about who i'd like to see all I want, but in the end its the fucking Daywalker who will decide the teams fate with his decisions. Raiderfan can only hope that he has learned from his ass backwards and horrific choices, is willing to man up and admit them, and move forward in the right direction.

An excellent start for me would be the re-hiring of Ron Wolf.

The Assassin · Post by **The Assassin** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 4:43 am

I'll throw 3 names out.

Al Saunders-he was interviewed last year and runs the type of offense Al likes.

Mike Martz-If the stubborn old goat (Davis not Martz) could relinquish some of his power Martz could turn this teams offense around in a hurry

Dick Vermeil-don't laugh, you never thought Bill Parcells would work for Jerry Jones did ya??

drummer · Post by **drummer** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 5:28 am

The Assassin wrote:I'll throw 3 names out.

Al Saunders-he was interviewed last year and runs the type of offense Al likes.

Mike Martz-If the stubborn old goat (Davis not Martz) could relinquish some of his power Martz could turn this teams offense around in a hurry

Dick Vermeil-don't laugh, you never thought Bill Parcells would work for Jerry Jones did ya??

Saunders - An article out of the Washington Post reports of friction between Saunders and Gibbs due to differences of offensive philosophy. Clinton Portis was on a radio show dishing out the dirt about the state of the locker room, as well as he saying Saunders and Gibbs were not talking to each other, and he also said he and Saunders don't speak with each other as well. This is stuff I got from a Redskins board. But the article in the Post reveals some real trouble with that team.

I dunno if that means Gibbs and Saunders won't continue their course together, but given the drama in Oakland, that may scare Saunders off if he were available.

Martz- He is a crazy fukker, and his stint in St. Louis was another huge soap opera, battling the Armey, Shaw, Zygmut, and pretty much anybody else in the FO. Shaw blamed him for the Super Bowl loss, and it was downhill for Martz there ever since. Martz is a detail and control freak about his offense. Combine that another control freak in Davis. The ensuing drama would be fun to watch, but only if you weren't Raiderfan.

Davis interviewed Martz for the job before he hired Shell, after he requested an interview.

Vermiel- No fukken way would Vermiel go out like that.

T1B

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