Plumbing experts, weigh in

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 2:19 am

No, I'm not asking about Jsc's GI tract.

How much should it cost to replace a busted sewer line that's 120' from the house and 8' deep to the city main?

Estimates should include trenching out a line past/thru 50-75 year old tree roots thicker than ucant's biceps.

While you're crunching numbers, estimate how much it should cost to remove said worthless, pain in the ass trees along a 175' property line.

Dins and 'holic, I reckon you're first in line with bids, Derron being the dark horse to show.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 2:55 am

I'm pretty sure you'll be needing some ball bearings.

Y2K · Post by **Y2K** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 6:37 am

Wags..
Pretty much depends on how much of the line you plan to replace. Obviously all areas with root problems and at least 10 ft. or so past that, First off as a plumber I'm calling in a backhoe, there's no fucking way I'm going down 8 fucking feet in your leaking family stench for less than 2 or 3 grand not counting material or the damn backhoe.

Dig a big hole so I won't die down there and just fix the leak?
Different story.

Rooster · Post by **Rooster** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:51 am

Ouch. That is gonna be expensive. Tree removal can range from cheap for cutting it down and grinding out the stump or to completely expensive where they remove the root ball where it it runs upwards of $3,000 a tree. The length of the run suggests that there are a number of trees, so multiply that figure times however many trees you want removed. As for the digging, that can be crazy expensive too. If the roots have broken the pipe and you are concerned there are other places where the pipe is weak or in danger of clogging due to the roots growing inside, then yes, it is going to run you in the thousands.

We had a sewer pipe which had been rusted out and the chitulpa trees had gotten into the pipe for water. The run was only 40 feet, but the cost to repair/replace the section which was broken cost $6000.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 11:03 am

I haven't a fukking clue about estimating ditch digging jobs. [something you'll rarely hear from me]I'd listen to duhron on this one. [/something you'll rarely hear from me]

If I had to throw out a rough guess though, I'd say $7,824.79 + tax and fees.

You may get out of this for under 10 grand.

May.

And don't go cheap on those fukking trees that likely started the whole mess. Kill those fukkers and dig up every last root.

Looks like it's natti light rather than budweiser at casa wags for the foreseeable future. pretty bad when you have to downgrade from bud.

Wolfman · Post by **Wolfman** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:06 pm

Good luck.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:18 pm

Look into the trenchless repair systems that hundreds of companies are offering today.

They can often replace your whole sewer line in a day or two with no digging.

If that won't work your next call should be to a Realtor.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:22 pm

smackaholic wrote:If I had to throw out a rough guess though, I'd say $7,824.79 + tax and fees.

You may get out of this for under 10 grand.

Tack another 25 cents on to your estimate., 'cuz it sounds like he'll be needing it.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 1:42 pm

Huh, I thought this thread would be about the British Airways flight that had to return to London because of something deposited in the toilet.

http://www.vice.com/en_ca/read/someone- ... d-land-475

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:01 pm

Trenchless pipe bursting method won't work in residential applications. Be nice if it could, but you still have to have manual connection points and it is generally not approved or work very well in established subdivision type settings in our area any way.

EDIT: This is the case in the U & L. The set up of the hoods in Leftys area, lend themselves to trenchless and pipe bursting applications much easier since those Texans had about 1/2 an acre or better each house, with no curbs in a lot of places, and plenty of room to get your directional equipment in there. The fucking land Nazis here in the U & L are now piling these house at 25 to the acre or better, and even 35 year old hoods are too tight for that application.

Day one - Three men 8 hours @ $65 per hour = $ 1,560 Demolition and site prep complicated by large tree roots
Dump truck and back hoe @ $ 125 hr each for 8 hours = $ 2,000
Permits - $ 350
New sewer pipe - $ 500

Day two - Finish old line removal - start laying in new line - coffin added to cost at $ 150 per day One load of gravel to bed new line
Three men 8 hours @ $65 per hour = $ 1,560
Dump truck and back hoe @ $ 125 hr each for 8 hours = $ 2,000
Gravel - $ 350
4th man for coffin operations / safety - $ 520

Day three - Final compactions - site clean up and restoration
Three men 8 hours @ $65 per hour = $ 1,560
Dump truck and back hoe @ $ 125 hr each for 8 hours = $ 2,000

Total around $ 12,400.

Some may charge a bit less on the equipment cost, but only about $ 1,500 at the most, have to cover coffin cost. Also since it is KC you have the potential to have to pay bribes to the inspectors and other gubmint corrupt officials. Labor cost per hour could vary either way some, but that would be the rule in the U&L.

Tree removal depends on many things, chunking it down, stump removal, how many trees, access...$ 3,500 minimum and sky is the limit from there.

Being down in a trench 8 feet deep is no fucking picnic..I have been there and do not like it one bit.

R-Jack · Post by **R-Jack** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:57 pm

Have you tried restoring your pipes to a previous date?

Python · Post by **Python** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:23 pm

Try acting white for a day. Problem should fix itself.

Shlomart Ben Yisrael · Tue Mar 17, 2015 6:24 pm

War Wagon wrote:...thicker than ucant's biceps.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 11:18 pm

I had a hunch Derron would pretty much nail it. Man knows of what he speaks.

Luckily, I had a friend of friend. He and his partner came out and did the whole sewer line in 2 days and it cost $4,900 - told me a job like that from a commercial company would've cost $12,500 and I've no doubt it would.

They had originally said it would be $4k and they planned to have it all done in one day. But those fucking tree roots slowed them down and they had to rent the backhoe for an extra day.

Those guys showed up at 7 am Sunday and worked non-stop until they ran out of daylight. They have regular full time jobs and do stuff on the side, under the table, on a cash only basis on weekends. Monday they came back after work and finished up just before dark.

The cheap bastard asshole who built this house in 1980 used schedule 20 PVC pipe for the original sewer line. :brad: That shouldn't even be legal. What, to save like $200? Permits? Fuck KC if they ask for a permit. I'll ask them where was the fucking permit in 1980, I want to see it.

There's schedule 40 pipe under this shit hole now and while it may still be a shit hole, it's my fucking shit hole.

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 12:54 am

War Wagon wrote:
The cheap bastard asshole who built this house in 1980 used schedule 20 PVC pipe for the original sewer line. :brad: That shouldn't even be legal. What, to save like $200? Permits? Fuck KC if they ask for a permit. I'll ask them where was the fucking permit in 1980, I want to see it.

Probably Schedule 200..that is real thin wall shit and most likely it was not legal, kind of like the scab ass job you got from those fly by nighters you hired. Good luck getting them back when something fucks up and you own shit backs up on your ass in the toilet. Your job is not legal and you expect the cheaper than you guy who put the original in to be legal ??

They actually make a pipe specific for sewer lines, but rank ass scabs will use the Schedule 40 PVC, it is cheaper..and probably will last you just fine.

They bother to put a laser or transit on it to make sure the fall is correct and no bellies in the line ??

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 1:24 am

Not fly by nighters, good men who earned well placed trust. They'll be back if needed.

You don't need a laser, just a level.

You can't stand prosperity.

Y2K · Post by **Y2K** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 4:07 am

I had a hunch Derron would pretty much nail it. Man knows of what he speaks.

Dude gave you an estimate for 12,000+ on a 4500 dollar job...

Like I said without looking at it...2 or 3 grand plus backhoe and material
aka.
what you paid.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 5:45 am

Y2K wrote:Dude gave you an estimate for 12,000+ on a 4500 dollar job...

Yeah, I read his estimate and was like... :|

Sounds like he's raping people.

Maybe Derron has to pay for his spawns's psychiatric treatment.
... or other treatments.

Understand, and give him your heart.

Y2K · Post by **Y2K** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 6:07 am

Understand, and give him your heart.

Oh I understand completely, if I could grab that much cash outta that job I would.

I have no problem making a solid 3 or 4 hundred an hour.

He's right though, going 8 ft down in a wet sewage trench sucks serious ass. I too have been there Hazmat style suit and all.

Python · Post by **Python** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 11:19 am

War Wagon wrote:
You don't need a laser, just a level.

Don't trust Whitey.
See a doctor and get rid of it.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 12:42 pm

Hey, duhron, what schedule pipe did the doc use on your shit pipe?

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 12:43 pm

And did he laser level it?

Imus · Post by **Imus** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 6:12 pm

what schedule pipe did the doc use on your shit pipe?

~ swoon~

AP

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 7:40 pm

Y2K wrote:
Understand, and give him your heart.
Oh I understand completely, if I could grab that much cash outta that job I would.

I have no problem making a solid 3 or 4 hundred an hour.

Yeah, because you work 40 hours a week all year long right ?..your seasonal weather never shuts you down to 9 months of work a year..

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 7:42 pm

War Wagon wrote:Not fly by nighters, good men who earned well placed trust. They'll be back if needed.

You don't need a laser, just a level.

You can't stand prosperity.

Yeah, you want a non pressure sewer line to be completely level....

and because those week end scabs can get a 120 foot run properly sloped with hand level???..for crist sakes Wags..really ??

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 7:55 pm

Y2K wrote:
I had a hunch Derron would pretty much nail it. Man knows of what he speaks.
Dude gave you an estimate for 12,000+ on a 4500 dollar job...

Like I said without looking at it...2 or 3 grand plus backhoe and material
aka.
what you paid.

Sure is is a $ 4,500 job if you :

1. Do not pay any liability insurance so when the trench collapses and kills somebody, they can have the fucking shack Wags calls home and he can be out on his ass panhandling for beer money. Saves you a solid $ 12,000 to $ 15,00 a year there.

2. Just rent the back hoe,and don't bother having it on site to help in all aspects of the job. Saves you a solid $ 1,500 per month there.

3. Skip the workmens comp insurance to save a solid $ 24,000 per year. After all, what could happen in an underground trench or with a moving excavator around ??

4. Are some homeboys doing this shit on the week ends for crack money and not have any real expenses to pay with it. You can undercut anybody to get the job.

5. Can get the job done it 2 days cutting all the corners. Good luck getting them back when that trench drops a good 18 inches or better after the rains settle it in a bit. Compacting the backfill is another place you can save some huge hours. And it will drop unless those reputable non fly by nighters used a trench compaction tool on it.

6. No need to have proper fall, just use a level.

Saves you a solid $ 125 or so to rent a laser...since the rented excavator probably did not have the laser on the backhoe with the in cab readout for getting the trench properly sloped the first time.

Seriously, that level comment is fucking hilarious...Note how level these lines are....

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 8:04 pm

poptart wrote:
Y2K wrote:Dude gave you an estimate for 12,000+ on a 4500 dollar job...
Yeah, I read his estimate and was like... :|

Sounds like he's raping people.

Wags wrote:Luckily, I had a friend of friend. He and his partner came out and did the whole sewer line in 2 days and it cost $4,900 - told me a job like that from a commercial company would've cost $12,500 and I've no doubt it would.

Even though I crack on Wags, your Bible thumping perverted mind failed to read and grasp this comment he made. I did operate a commercial company paying all the required costs, and I had no lack of $ 12,500 sewer line drain line installations. In our state, there are a fair number of these scab ass week end warriors working. Most do small stuff and stay away from more technical work. I had the state inspectors on my phone and could have them out and shut pricks like that down all day. We could easily knock out almost 2 of those jobs a week.

So skin it back and jam it in baby..those checks were nice taking to the bank. And guess what..no call backs,no pissed off customers. And I had my weekends off...whilst Wags boys were back sleeping at their sausage making jobs again Monday morning.

Y2K · Post by **Y2K** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 8:39 pm

Derron,

any decent licensed, bonded and insured plumbing contractor could knock that out in a heartbeat for less than 5 grand...

Make up all the numbers you want but face it sewer line repair is easy shit especially with a backhoe.
For chrissakes you dont need 3 guys to watch a machine dig a trench. You dont need anything fancy to figure out something as simple as a drop in elevation, that is simpleton work. All you need is a inexpensive plumb and level laser from Lowes, a tape measure and a damned stick...ya know up the stick means pipe is going down and down the stick mean it's rising...

I will take some notes on your expose on charging the fuck outta people it'll come in handy when some cheap ass Punjab or Armenian cocksucker bitches because I charged him $125.00 to reset his toilet because it leaks at the wax seal.
I like the "you should see what we pay in insurance" angle. Now that we have Obammycare they might even buy it...

Bucmonkey · Post by **Bucmonkey** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 9:58 pm

Christ Derron...

... you must be quite the salesman.

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 11:19 pm

Y2K wrote:Derron,

any decent licensed, bonded and insured plumbing contractor could knock that out in a heartbeat for less than 5 grand...

So you would concur then that Wags got fucked by his friend of a friend week end boys..no need to charge $ 4,900 if they are not licensed, bonded and insured.

Y2K wrote:I will take some notes on your expose on charging the fuck outta people it'll come in handy when some cheap ass Punjab or Armenian cocksucker bitches because I charged him $125.00 to reset his toilet because it leaks at the wax seal.

What is your minimum charge then ?? Last HVAC guy we had at my wife's store had a $ 96 minimum service call fee. Seems pretty standard to me. If you are paying a journeyman plumber $ 30 per hour, he better be billing $ 90 or better to cover labor, overheads and profit. $ 125 to reset a leaking toilet by a licenses plumber seems OK to me, Minimum 1.5 hr including travel is $ 85 an hour. Hardly seems like you are fucking them at that rate. If you billed 2000 hours a year at that rate that is 160K. Knock 40.50 per hour out of that for the wages and labor burden that is $ 81,000. That leaves you 79K for overhead expenses of say 35%, that leaves 51,350 net profit on one plumber. This is if you are good enough operationally to bill 2000 hours a year for each employee

One plumbing contractor I know has 11 plumbers working for him. ..he lives in a million dollar house with a front door that cost $ 11,000, the arrogant cocksucker likes to brag about, he is probably netting 560K even after paying himself in overhead.

Of course in your market you might pay a journeyman $ 20 an hour, because all you have to know to be a plumber is shit runs down hill and payday is on Friday.

Any time you want to talk labor costs, overhead recovery, and net profit on hourly service based business's let me know, it is pretty simple math and time management..I did construction company consulting and operational turn around work for a few years..it is simple math which a lot of contractors have trouble with.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:48 am

Derron wrote:Minimum 1.5 hr including travel is $ 85 an hour. Hardly seems like you are fucking them at that rate. If you billed 2000 hours a year at that rate that is 160K.

..it is simple math which a lot of contractors have trouble with.

All righty then.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:02 am

Papa Willie wrote:This is about actual plumbing, Goobs. Not your fucked up vagina. Besides - you went through the "change" what - 20 or 30 years ago?

So you don't understand basic math either. Not too surprising.

Here's a hint, moron. Multiply 85 x 2000 and tell me what you get.

Y2K · Post by **Y2K** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 5:40 am

Derron,
I've just been giving you some shit just because Whitey asked about plumbers.

Every day is different as are the jobs to do.

BTW, I charge a service call at $90 or so depending on distance.

Gotta love a easy 5 or 6 service call day,
:bode:

Y2K · Post by **Y2K** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 6:06 am

So you would concur then that Wags got fucked by his friend of a friend week end boys..no need to charge $ 4,900 if they are not licensed, bonded and insured.

I can't ignore this because it's an excellent question.

I've done jobs as a fliend of "in my case" a REAL good fliend situation just like Wags
outside Freedom Plumbing,

Can you fix this?...ummm depends on the situation
Can you pay cash?..... yes
Can you work a weekend? ...maybe
1099? ....umm no

Boss can't fire me I'm the best man at his wedding this Saturday

Survival...

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 1:03 pm

Papa Willie wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote:
Papa Willie wrote:This is about actual plumbing, Goobs. Not your fucked up vagina. Besides - you went through the "change" what - 20 or 30 years ago?
So you don't understand basic math either. Not too surprising.

Here's a hint, moron. Multiply 85 x 2000 and tell me what you get.
I'm not even talking about the subject of this thread

You never do. You just talk about gay sex. And feces. Moron.

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:14 pm

I'm not a plumbing expert (beyond calling a plumber to sub), but since I was named, I'll respond:

I weigh in at about 185 these days.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 5:31 pm

KC Scott wrote: Blue States sure seem to pay a lot more for simple labor than red states

Unions? Not being right to work? Greed?

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 6:29 pm

Papa Willie wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote: You never do. You just talk about gay sex. And feces. Moron.
I also talk about how fucking old you are. Don't forget about that.

That makes you even more of a moron. I'm 62.

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 7:07 pm

KC Scott wrote:
Derron wrote: Tree removal depends on many things, chunking it down, stump removal, how many trees, access...$ 3,500 minimum and sky is the limit from there.
As long as we're piling on - this $3500 min estimate for tree removal is hilarious too

Blue States sure seem to pay a lot more for simple labor than red states

Ok dick stick....lets say you have a 100 foot tall shade tree in a back yard of an upscale hood. This is a solid 3 man job for a day,leaving all non chippable wood on the ground for the zip / slope/ raghead/ dothead/ Armeian cocksucker / to deal with. One guy is up in the tree cutting the light branch's down, one or two guys hauling to the chipper. Then you get to the bigger wood. you are chuncking it down in 3 foot chunks on ropes. The you get to the real big wood and it takes even more time cutting up into rounds. You ave no crane access, no loader or excavator access and the dude paying the bill wants it left cleaner than it was.

This is every bit of 45 hours work. That is $ 77 per man hour with no dump fees and tree work is dollar for dollar on your workmen's comp. Wags gave very little info on the weed trees he was referring to, they could have been 8 inch trees or 38 inch trees.

And Blue states do pay more, because all the fucking liberal fools who have never ran a business impose all these bullshit rules, regulations, arts taxes, welfare for crack heads, make business's pay for the fucking worthless mass transit trains so the dope dealers can move their weight around, so it costs huge amounts more to do business.

And now the dumb cunts on the Portland City Council are now banning smoking on the city golf courses, about 5 of them I believe, imagine the greens fees they will lose when Dins cannot blow a bowl on the back nice or smoke a cigar either, AND the Oregon State Parks system is has now banned smoking in all its state parks....

So yeah, fuck these blue states and their bullshit ways.

Y2K · Post by **Y2K** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 8:38 pm

Tree removal is a miseable job. Swinging through trees with a chainsaw, stump grinding, Hauling wood?

No fucking way.
The only job worse than jackhammering concrete is a fucking stump grinder.
I did that once...never again

and yeah
Fuck Blue States!