Ding dong the wicked bitch is dead

[Killian]

Fuck you Kevin White. Have fun at Duke. Hopefully this administration hires someone with some balls.

[PSUFAN]

Congrats!

[King Crimson]

from what i glean from Killian and T in C that's good news for ND fans.

still can't wait for that epic barnstorming tilt with Wazzou in San Antonio. The Riverwalk is and will always be a hot bed for Cougar fans.

[Screw_Michigan]

Fuck this.

Sincerely,

ND football haters, the other 110 1-A football programs.

Talk about this shit happening in the middle of the night. I was really looking forward to future matchups of the Irish vs. Duke in Baltimore or the Irish vs. Cornell in San Diego.

BRING BACK KW!

[Danimal]

Congrats ND-fan.

As a fan of a team that recently got rid of their POS-AD I know how you are feeling.

[Left Seater]

Leading names?

[FLW Buckeye]

Stay away from Gene Smith. He's doing a fair job in C-bus, and a definite improvement over the assclown that he replaced.

[Killian]

They won't go after Gene Smith, nor do I think Smith wants the job. He's got a good gig at Ohio State.

As far as names, I would say that the leading candidates are Steve Orsini (SMU AD), Rick Chryst (MAC Commish), Bubba Cunningham (internal at ND) and possibly Jim Lynch (businessman and has some association with the KC Chiefs).

Chryst will likely not be chosen because he has no AD experience. But, he is the protoge of former ND AD Gene Corrigan, the only other person besides White who was not an ND alumnus.

Cunningham doesn't stand a shot in hell because he is too tied to Monk Malloy/Lou Nanni.

Lynch has been consulted on virtually every major football move in the last 15 years and has been approached at least twice in the past for this position. Doubtful he will take it.

That leaves Orsini as the guy who I think will likely, and should be chosen. He has done great things at SMU and Central Florida, making huge hires for both schools. He has spent time in the ND athletic department, has spent time with the Cowboys, and is a CPA and worked with the firm that is now Delloite and Touche.

Orsini should be the man to get the job.

[Adelpiero]

ND loses a 80 year vet.

my great uncle who's been following ND football for 80 years died monday



he told me weis said no more 5-6, i then told him there is always 4-8,3-9, and 2-10. oh how i loved to call him when nd lost. oh well, rack em anyway

[Left Seater]

So to hear that.

[Terry in Crapchester]

Wow. I was incommunicado for a few days due to dealing with some work/home matters, so I didn't hear about this right away. A great development for ND.

White, by most accounts, was a decent person and probably would be a competent athletic director at about 80% of Division I schools. He was a horrible fit for ND, however. Much like Bob Davie, who never quite got that ND wasn't Texas A&M North, White never really got that ND wasn't Arizona State East.

White always reminded me of the real-life, unfunny version of George Costanza as the Assistant to the Traveling Secretary of the Yankees: no matter how badly he screwed up, he couldn't get fired. I was beginning to think that he had incriminating photos of key figures in ND's administration. And it's still amazing to me that he was able to get out on his own terms (sort of, anyway). Good luck to him at Duke. And good luck to Duke Fan with White. If he stays at Duke as long as he stayed at ND (8 years), he'll likely be charged with hiring Coach K's successor. If I were Duke Fan, that thought would be enough to wake me up in the middle of the night in a cold sweat.

They won't go after Gene Smith, nor do I think Smith wants the job. He's got a good gig at Ohio State.

As far as names, I would say that the leading candidates are Steve Orsini (SMU AD), Rick Chryst (MAC Commish), Bubba Cunningham (internal at ND) and possibly Jim Lynch (businessman and has some association with the KC Chiefs).

Chryst will likely not be chosen because he has no AD experience. But, he is the protoge of former ND AD Gene Corrigan, the only other person besides White who was not an ND alumnus.

Cunningham doesn't stand a shot in hell because he is too tied to Monk Malloy/Lou Nanni.

Lynch has been consulted on virtually every major football move in the last 15 years and has been approached at least twice in the past for this position. Doubtful he will take it.

That leaves Orsini as the guy who I think will likely, and should be chosen. He has done great things at SMU and Central Florida, making huge hires for both schools. He has spent time in the ND athletic department, has spent time with the Cowboys, and is a CPA and worked with the firm that is now Delloite and Touche.

Orsini should be the man to get the job.

Orsini would be a great hire, imho, and of the names you mentioned, I think he'd be the most likely to get the job. That being said, the name I'm hearing being tossed around most frequently is John Paxson. He certainly has the requisite ND connection, as well as experience in sports management. But running a college athletic department is different from running a NBA franchise (sin, you know who). Not saying that Paxson wouldn't be capable of learning on the job, but this throws in a level of difficulty that isn't present if Orsini is the hire.

Of all the names I've heard mentioned, the one that intrigues me the most is Digger Phelps. Because of his ESPN gig, he has a level of visibility with the young 'uns (most of whom probably don't know that he used to be ND's basketball coach unless they do some research). And he'd certainly bring back a swagger to ND's athletic department that has been sorely missing for quite some time. OTOH, at the risk of making a Joe Moore-esque comment, he'll be 67 years old next month, so I couldn't see him as anything more than a stopgap.

Also, Chris Zorich is joining ND's athletic department as Manager of Student Welfare and Development. http://und.cstv.com/genrel/060308aaa.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; That's a good fit for him, imho. Who knows, maybe he'll be an Athletic Director someday, although he's quite clearly not ready for that yet.

[King Crimson]

stopgap maybe, but if it were me i personally wouldn't get too excited about Digger. hoops fans and ESPN wonks may not remember him as a coach, but he's one of the worst, doesn't do his homework/or give a shit analysts that i can think of. that, most sports fans can plainly see. on the rumor by and by, Stacey Dales off-the-record in Oklahoma is pretty unambiguous that Dig is a kind of a real scumbag. but, whatever, as i'm in training to be a dirty old man myself i'm certainly not going to talk somebody down for achieving full status. continuing on, as a fundraiser type figure, OK. but, I think Digger would be a disaster making administrative decisions left to his own. give him a Dick Cheney and competent admin staff and send Digger out to raise money....best case scenario IMO.

Orsini's big hires are whom? Matt Doherty and June Jones. the latter, you never know til there are actual results on the scoreboard but on paper is a great hire. the former, not really panning out...but gutsy, i guess. though, Matt may still be fairly well regarded in South Bend. so, that may not be as much a hovering question mark as it might be at most other places.

[Killian]

Digger is a total scumbag, on many levels.

Orisini's big hires have to be put in context. Hiring June Jones, Matt Doherty and George O'Leary wouldn't be considered big time at major universities, but those are huge hires for SMU and UCF, respectively. SMU is now one of only a handful of schools that has a coach of the year running the football and basketball programs.

Either way, I have heard that Rick Chryst may have the inside track. If so, that's still a very good hire. Anyone Gene Corrigan recomends is ok in my book.

[King Crimson]

Digger is a total scumbag, on many levels.

Orisini's big hires have to be put in context. Hiring June Jones, Matt Doherty and George O'Leary wouldn't be considered big time at major universities, but those are huge hires for SMU and UCF, respectively. SMU is now one of only a handful of schools that has a coach of the year running the football and basketball programs.

Either way, I have heard that Rick Chryst may have the inside track. If so, that's still a very good hire. Anyone Gene Corrigan recomends is ok in my book.

How would Matt Doherty be in the running for Coach of the Year even in C-USA? unless you mean the SMU women's coach, Doh's Ponies went 10-20 last year and (i looked at this, this AM) like 13 or 14 by double digits.

edit: i guess you mean when Matt D was at ND. that's the only thing i can figure....and, still, without being argumentative, i don't really see the major cache in that. as you say, the context is Doherty was Coach of the Year (if he was) and he's parlayed that into the SMU job...?

[Killian]

SMU went out and got a coach that was an assistant at UNC, head coach at Notre Dame, and head coach at UNC. Even if he was a failure at UNC, he has an excellent pedigree. They didn't have to go get the coach at Niagra or Evansville. Doh may have been underwhelming at UNC, but that was a great hire, even if in name only, for SMU.

[King Crimson]

SMU went out and got a coach that was an assistant at UNC, head coach at Notre Dame, and head coach at UNC. Even if he was a failure at UNC, he has an excellent pedigree. They didn't have to go get the coach at Niagra or Evansville. Doh may have been underwhelming at UNC, but that was a great hire, even if in name only, for SMU.

i don't really agree. Doherty was radioactive after the May/McCants etc. class basically got him fired. and he coached terribly that final year at UNC (i remember watching one of the games against Duke and he was jumping up and down like a clown and they were getting backdoored to high Blue Devil Heaven). So, instead of Niagra or Evansville SMU went and got the guy at Florida Atlantic? you can defend your guy, but "context" is he may have a pedigree but he was the Fla. Atlantic coach at the time.

i think you underestimate SMU. they are certainly not a "player" anymore but they once were (kinda like Doherty). Dave Bliss had some very good top 20 teams at SMU in hoops and they contended in the old SWC in football--and they sure as hell outbid OU and Texas for Eric Dickerson (oh wait, everyone else cheats to KEEP UP with Texas). it's an expensive private school but it ain't Stanford, Vandy or Notre Dame asmuch as they now pretend to wanna be....my sister works there and it's country club city. it's a good school (because they have money and buy faculty), but it's not great. and they spend money on sports (and have deep pocket oil money alums); that they are no better in C-USA is a mystery....sitting in the middle of DFW unable to pull north Texas talent?

like i say it was a gutsy hire, i don't think it was a great hire. and if Big Matt wins C-USA in year 2, let's say, how long do you think he's staying at SMU? i'll give you that it was a "name" hire, but not a great hire. a school like SMU is probably better off hiring the hot young guy at Evansville that coaches his ass off than a retread like Doherty IMO.

edit: Doherty was also as assistant at Kansas under Roy, FWIW. pedigree, shmedigree....Quinn Snyder has a pedigree and made the Elite Eight and 3-4 NCAA tournaments (better than Doherty ever did). He's coaching the Austin Toros in the D-League. Tommy Amaker makes the NCAA once at Seton Hall, has a top 5 recruiting class and highballs Michigan into an NIT legend and then starts playing fast and loose with the rules at Harvard.

[Sky]

Stay away from Gene Smith. He's doing a fair job in C-bus, and a definite improvement over the assclown that he replaced.

Poor form. Geiger had a couple issues (Maurice and O'Brien) near the end of his tenure but he also got rid of Cooper, brought in Tressel and brought in Matta.......


So yeah, assclown sounds like a good label.

[Screw_Michigan]

Digger is a total scumbag, on many levels.

Second-hand experience: My friend is a pilot out at the airport in Oakland County (Mich.) and was charged with bringing Digger back from the Palace to South Bend after a speech he gave. He said from the moment he got on the plane, Digger was belligerently drunk, started screaming at him and his co-pilot because he couldn't open the twist off beers that were on the plane, then was pissed at the quality of the beer (probably Whitey's favorite), then passed out in the middle of the flight. Digger made sure to leave a lasting impression by berating my friend for waking his ass up when they arrived in SB.

I'm sure he'd make a GREAT AD.

[Screw_Michigan]

One name I heard mention as soon as White decided to leave was the AD at Minnesota. Bit surprised he hasn't been brought up in this thread.

There are many people in the MAC circle who aren't huge fans of Chryst. I met him on a couple of occasions while in school and he seemed really smart. But there are a lot of people who dislike him because of how he failed to improve the positive exposure of MAC football and basketball over the years. Although he got regular MAC games on ESPN, they ended up being Tue/Wed/Thu/Fri affairs. MAC basketball is also still a perennial one-bid league, unlike the Missouri Valley, and he's done little to change that since he arrived. On that note, he also got the MAC involved in the ridiculous Bracket Buster bullshit, where one team gets on TV and the others get on ESPN360 or not at all, playing some shit team from another shit league. Bracket Buster is anything but: It's intended to keep the small schools playing against each other instead of knocking off big-time basketball programs.

[MgoBlue-LightSpecial]

Although he got regular MAC games on ESPN, they ended up being Tue/Wed/Thu/Fri affairs.

So? That's about as good as it's going to get for the MAC. When BIG TIME POWAH college football rolls around on Saturday afternoons, nobody is interested in Western vs Buffalo. Weeknight CFB games are a brilliant idea for the smaller conference schools. It gives people an opportunity to check out teams they wouldn't normally give two shits about on Saturdays. It's all about national exposure any way you can get it.

[Screw_Michigan]

It's all about national exposure any way you can get it.

Not when you turn "Central/Western Weekend" into "Central/Western Tuesday Night," dumbfuck. I don't really mind if a NIU/WMU game gets moved mid-week, but taking the biggest game (and weekend) of the year and shitting down the throats of paying fans and alumni is insulting. Obviously the league cares more about TV dollars than dollars at the gate.

Whoring yourself for the television dollar is only about greasing the coffers, not about national exposure. MAC teams get national exposure by beating the big boys, not by playing a game on Wednesday night, bumblefuck.

[MgoBlue-LightSpecial]

Not when you turn "Central/Western Weekend" into "Central/Western Tuesday Night," dumbfuck. I don't really mind if a NIU/WMU game gets moved mid-week, but taking the biggest game (and weekend) of the year and shitting down the throats of paying fans and alumni is insulting.

I can understand that, but that seems off track from what your original point was. You were talking about "positive exposure." Exactly what did you mean by that then? Certainly positive exposure won't be gained when you're competing with the Big Ten for Saturday slots on ESPN.

[Left Seater]

MAC teams get national exposure by beating the big boys, not by playing a game on Wednesday night, bumblefuck.

Got to disagree on a couple of fronts. WMU knocks off Iowa. We see it on sportscenter here in Sugar Land. That's it. We see WMU on ESPN three times during the season even if its Tues/Wed/Thur nite and now we are talking about "that WMU running back" at work. Single exposures don't mean much. Repeated exposure is where it is at.

Second recruits want to be on TV. Period.

[M Club]

i hope that barnstorming idea hasn't left along with white. i'd love to see nd-iowa state in nova scotia or nd-georgia in atlanta. what, atlanta's a neutral site, by sec standards.

[Terry in Crapchester]

Lots to comment on in this thread . . .

George O'Leary wouldn't be considered ... at major universities

Domer fan, how quickly you forget.

Dammit, BtH, I was gonna give White one last shot on his way out the door, and you had to go and take the fun out of it. :brad:

Of course, Killian's point is taken, to an extent anyway. That was a totally underwhelming hire from the perspective of ND fan (or at least this one), even before Resumegate. Strike One for White at the time, too bad he got about 800 of them before he left.

Digger is a total scumbag, on many levels.

Second-hand experience: My friend is a pilot out at the airport in Oakland County (Mich.) and was charged with bringing Digger back from the Palace to South Bend after a speech he gave. He said from the moment he got on the plane, Digger was belligerently drunk, started screaming at him and his co-pilot because he couldn't open the twist off beers that were on the plane, then was pissed at the quality of the beer (probably Whitey's favorite), then passed out in the middle of the flight. Digger made sure to leave a lasting impression by berating my friend for waking his ass up when they arrived in SB.

I'm sure he'd make a GREAT AD.

Since you brought this up . . .

I've long since suspected Digger of engaging in some historical revisionism after he left ND. It's pretty much conventional wisdom now that during his last five years or so at ND, Digger was working behind the scenes to get ND into a basketball conference. The only problem is, that conventional wisdom doesn't exactly jive with what I know.

I was a junior at ND in the fall of 1984 when Digger came and spoke to us at the Stanford Hall party room. Among other things, Digger said, "Notre Dame will never play in a basketball conference as long as I'm the coach here." (That's pretty close to verbatim if not exact.) As it turned out, that statement was somewhat prophetic, given that ND joined the Big East for basketball not long after Digger left. But I think it was designed to show his state of mind. Anyway, I've been trying to reconcile the conventional wisdom with what I heard out of the horse's mouth, and I've only come up with the following options:

1. Digger engaged in historical revisionism after he left ND.
2. Digger was toeing the company line when he spoke to us.
3. Digger had a major epiphany about the basketball program very shortly (i.e., no more than 1-2 years) after he spoke to us.

Of the three, I'd say the last one is the least likely. Of all the possibilities in the world, that one exists, I suppose. But Digger was nothing if not stubborn. If he did change his mind on anything, likely that came only after a lot of thinking about it, not all at once as almost certainly would have been the case here.

If it's option #2, certainly Digger wouldn't be the first nor the last person ever to do that. But he seemed just a tad too convincing, if that's what he was doing. Throw in the fact that Digger wound up working for the WWL, which likely would not have hired someone it considered a dinosaur, and certainly there's a motive for historical revisionism.

As for your story, doesn't surprise me in the least. Digger used to berate his basketball players, and even the student-managers (who weren't even on scholarship until their senior year) like nobody's business. Digger always had his basketball practices divided into a number of drills, most of which (except for free throw shooting at the end of practice) lasted no more than 5-10 minutes apiece. Each practice, one lucky student manager got "Digger duty." You followed Digger around with a clipboard and a stopwatch, had to keep track of each drill and exactly how much time remained in each drill. Digger would frequently ask you how much time was left in the drill. Screw up, just once, and Digger would let you have it in front of everyone in the gym. OTOH, Digger was always fiercely loyal in public to anyone connected to ND's basketball program in any way (including the student-managers). And he was never anything but a gentleman to me. Dunno why, maybe he took a liking to me.

On a more serious note, I actually think Digger could do the job. He doesn't have any work experience directly on point, but he did work briefly at the U.S. Dept. of Education, and was ND's basketball coach for about 20 years or so, so he certainly has some exposure to ND's fanbase. And while he was ND's basketball coach, his program always was at or near the top in terms of NCAA graduation rates, so he has a proven track record in the area that's probably most important for ND's athletic department. He's also actually a smart guy (although not quite as smart as he thinks he is). As I said, the biggest concerns I would have would be his age and his arrogance. A little arrogance would actually be a good thing after 8 years of White's BOHICA act. But Digger could easily overdo it in that regard.

[TheJON]

Terry,

Don't personally care much for Digger Phelps. Think he's a flat out joke. ESPN is an even bigger joke but that's a topic for another day.

But I was stunned by something you said. You mentioned when you were a junior at ND. So that means you are a Notre Dame fan AND you went to ND??? You are in a small minority sir, a very small minority!

[Terry in Crapchester]

Terry,

Don't personally care much for Digger Phelps. Think he's a flat out joke. ESPN is an even bigger joke but that's a topic for another day.

But I was stunned by something you said. You mentioned when you were a junior at ND. So that means you are a Notre Dame fan AND you went to ND??? You are in a small minority sir, a very small minority!

NOJ,

That's hardly news, I've mentioned it several times before.

As for me being part of a small minority, true, but perhaps you don't fully understand the reasons why. ND is a much smaller school than, say, Iowa, and in fact is a very small school in terms of enrollment by 1-A standards. Not the smallest in 1-A, but probably in the bottom 20. I've calculated before (rough estimate) that ND only has about 150,000 living alumni. I arrived at that figure due to the fact that ND graduates roughly 2,000 undergrads and 1,000 graduate students per year, multiplied by an average post-graduation life expectancy of 50 years. That latter number may be a little high given that many grad students don't go back to school until a little later in life. Also, that calculation doesn't account for people who receive more than one degree from ND, a phenomenon common enough to have earned its own gloss at ND (double-, etc., Domers, I believe the record is a quadruple-Domer).

But do you honestly think that ND ever would have gotten its own national TV deal if all it brought to the table was 150,000 or so living alumni and maybe their immediate families (which isn't as much as you would think, since 25% of each class at ND is reserved for legacies)?

i hope that barnstorming idea hasn't left along with white. i'd love to see nd-iowa state in nova scotia or nd-georgia in atlanta. what, atlanta's a neutral site, by sec standards.

I heard that before he left, White was negotiating ND-Hawaii in Greenland. After all, Greenland is an island too, so he probably figured the Hawaii folks would feel at home. :wink:

On a more serious note, ND-Georgia in Atlanta was the type of game I envisioned when I first heard about the barnstorming idea. Unfortunately, that idea became a disaster in White's hands. Imho, the barnstorming idea could work very well under the following circumstances:

1. The opponent is someone who is not routinely on ND's schedule.
2. The game is played in a geographic area which ND does not visit regularly, has some tie-in to the opponent, and where there's either a strong existing ND fanbase or potential to develop one.
3. ND receives more than the standard visitor's ticket allotment.
4. The game is televised either nationally or in a significant area of the country.

Imho, the new athletic director absolutely has to do away with 7-4-1. Do that, and he's already an improvement over White.

[TheJON]

I'm just busting your chops, Terry. Some of my best friends are ND fans and NONE of them attended ND so I give them shit about it. Seriously though, every school has a segment of their base that never attended the school. ISU fans give Iowa fans shit all the time about this same thing. We seem to have a lot of fans that never went to the University of Illinois at Iowa City (stole that from an ISU fan on a Cyclone message board and so cannot take credit for the name, although it's some great smack), but that's okay. I know of a ton of Iowa fans that grew up Hawkeye fans but went elsewhere for college because it better fit their career paths or they were offered scholarships at a small college to play sports or they just couldn't get into school.

I hear this a lot from ISU fans and it kinda irritates me. They're mad because they don't have a big fan base like Iowa does in the state and so they play the "well, half of you never even attended the U of I". Same thing for ND just on a larger scale.

I must say though, I'm kinda tired of seeing Notre Dame crap every town I go. It's a huge fan base. Even in Iowa there's a lot of Irish fans. However, one thing I notice about your fan base (well, at least the ones that didn't attend ND) is most of them couldn't give a crap about any other ND sports. Just football. That's kinda weak. That is what I have a problem with. Iowa has a lot of fans that never attended the school, but at least they support the Hawkeyes in all sports. Not sure you can say the same thing about Notre Dame's non-alumni fan base.

Yes, Killian, before you overeact here, I know you didn't go to ND and probably support the entire athletic department. I was just making a generalization here.

[M Club]

BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL is marketed and scrutinized just like any other professional sport. in usc's case, their players are paid in accordance. it's perfectly reasonable that people are die hard fans of schools they've never attended. i've been a michigan fan since i was 8-years-old and living in oregon. my father graduated college after me and my mother can't read, so it's not like i can claim it's an issue of legacy.

your criticism of people who only root for football but not other sports is silly. i trust you show up to all the kc soccer games in body paint, right? i like football but could care less about softball, track & field, swimming, rodeo, whatever other sports michigan fields a team for, so i'm not watching, let alone feeling bad they had a winless season.

[Terry in Crapchester]

the University of Illinois at Iowa City (stole that from an ISU fan on a Cyclone message board and so cannot take credit for the name, although it's some great smack),

When I was in law school, we had a visiting law professor from the University of Iowa. He mentioned that the common joke there was that the University of Iowa was located in Idaho City, Ohio. That's some good smack too (although it works better orally than in print).

one thing I notice about your fan base (well, at least the ones that didn't attend ND) is most of them couldn't give a crap about any other ND sports. Just football. That's kinda weak. That is what I have a problem with. Iowa has a lot of fans that never attended the school, but at least they support the Hawkeyes in all sports. Not sure you can say the same thing about Notre Dame's non-alumni fan base.

In all honesty, the only sports I really care about are football and men's basketball (in fairness, marketing probably has a little to do with that). Yes, I did go to see ND at the NCAA lacrosse tournament this year, but that was because it was so close to home for me and there was so much at stake for the team. And as I said, it was kind of a fluke that I even found out about it in the first place.

As I've said before, I'm actually a little embarrassed by the fact that we won a national championship in women's basketball before we won in men's basketball. If you had told me when I was a student that would happen, I would've said you were crazy.

[TheJON]

M Club,

That came out wrong. My point was that ND fans aren't really ND fans, they're bandwagon ND football fans. Half of them could give a rip about the University, or any of its athletic programs besides ND football.

I do not care about any other college sports besides mens hoops and football. If I loses every game in any other sport I would not give a rip. In fact, I root against Iowa in wrestling because I'm tired of hearing people talk about wrestling (although since I no longer live in the state perhaps it won't bother me anymore) and do not care to see us considered a wrestling school. I hate that fucking sport. However, I'm a proud supporter of the U of Iowa. And I'm sure you're a proud supporter of Umich. ND fans couldn't give a rip about the university or any other athletic program. They really have no affiliation with ND except they saw them on TV once and heard the national media masterbate to them so they started calling themselves Notre Dame fans. If I asked most ND fans for info on what to do in South Bend, Indiana they'd probably respond with "how am I supposed to know? I've never been there. Who plays there?"

Iowa fans, on the other hand, know the ins and outs of Iowa City and the U of Iowa. We all know that Burge Hall (dorm) is widely considered the STD capital of the midwest (or so I'm told), that the Iowa City police specifically look to bust the athletes downtown on the weekends, that it's one of the best party schools in the country, that the skanks are smokin' hot compared to ANY other midwest campus, that a large portion of our enrollment couldn't get into Illinois (hence the University of Illinois at Iowa City nickname), and that Steve Alford is a bitch!

[Terry in Crapchester]

However, I'm a proud supporter of the U of Iowa. And I'm sure you're a proud supporter of Umich. ND fans couldn't give a rip about the university or any other athletic program. They really have no affiliation with ND except they saw them on TV once and heard the national media masterbate to them so they started calling themselves Notre Dame fans. If I asked most ND fans for info on what to do in South Bend, Indiana they'd probably respond with "how am I supposed to know? I've never been there. Who plays there?"

Coupla points here . . .

1. Many (not all, obviously, but many) subway alumni are themselves family members or close friends of alumni.

2. Many other subway alumni are people who wanted to go to ND, but who did not for one reason or another -- didn't get accepted, weren't able to attend, etc.

3. It's virtually impossible for a person who is not (a) an alum; or (b) immediate family member of a current ND student (ND reserves one home date per year for parents) to obtain a GA ticket to a ND game unless you're willing to pay a rather significantly marked up price. ND's alumni base manages to snatch up virtually all of the GA tickets -- a pretty impressive feat when you consider, as I said previously, that there are only about 150,000 (and that's probably a generous estimate) living ND alumni.

4. You claim that the media "masterbate" (sic) to ND, yet you also fall for one of the frauds that the media perpetrates about ND: that it's located in South Bend, Indiana. Actually, ND is located near South Bend, not in it. And there's a lot of antipathy between the South Bend residents and ND, even though ND is easily the single largest employer in the area. I was a student at ND for four years, and I could probably count on one hand the number of times I went into South Bend that didn't involve a party at the residence of a student who lived off-campus. Today, I know that the College Football Hall of Fame is located there, but beyond that, I probably couldn't tell you of anything worthwhile to do in South Bend (as opposed to on ND's campus).

[Terry in Crapchester]

Update . . .

No hire yet. ND has hired an executive search committee to vet potential candidates, but Father Jenkins has said that he will make the final decision. This is the quiet time on campus, and a lot of university employees typically take vacation around this time. I wouldn't expect a decision before the last week of June in just about any event, and probably later than that.

The two leading candidates at this juncture appear to be Orsini and Chryst, but that doesn't mean that the hire will be one of them. I've also heard some sentiment for Dan Coonan, who is a ND alum (two years ahead of me) and is the current AD at Santa Clara and under consideration for Commissioner of the Pac-10. Coonan, while an Assistant AD at Kal, apparently made the Tedford hire.

Interestingly, while football coaches with ND degrees are relatively scarce, there doesn't appear to be any such shortage when it comes to athletic administrators. Minnesota AD Joel Maturi, who recently took himself out of consideration for the ND job, is also a ND alum. Perhaps the first order of business for the new AD will be to schedule that stadium dedication game with Minnesota. Don't get me wrong, I have no interest in seeing Minnesota on the schedule every year. But a two-season home-and-home, with their home game as the dedication game for their new stadium, and both games as the season openers for both schools, would be nice.

[Terry in Crapchester]

Further update: Orsini has withdrawn from consideration. http://therockreport.blogspot.com/2008/ ... l-and.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I get what ND is trying to do with the AD position right now, I really do. I only wish they had done it before they hired White.

[King Crimson]

Further update: Orsini has withdrawn from consideration. http://therockreport.blogspot.com/2008/ ... l-and.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I get what ND is trying to do with the AD position right now, I really do. I only wish they had done it before they hired White.

OK, overusing the word/concept "structure" is hilarious enough but also "requisite gravitas" and "enchilada", mixed in with a little Lou Holtz nostalgia....LOL.

[Terry in Crapchester]

a little Lou Holtz nostalgia....LOL.

Since you mentioned this . . .

That's one of my biggest pet peeves about ND Nation. Holtz is treated as some sort of demigod over there.

Holtz deserves credit for turning the program around following the Faust years, but that doesn't change the fact that he was a very imperfect coach as well. While I know this will sound like heresy to OU fan I was never a fan of Holtz' option offense, which I saw as already outdated by the time he got to ND. Holtz won at ND because he was an outstanding recruiter and master motivator who "got" ND well enough to win there. A brilliant offensive mind . . . not so much.

And in any hindsight analysis of Holtz' departure from ND, the Kimberly Dunbar situation has to be kept in mind. Granted, it's available only in hindsight, because it wasn't known in '96. But the most egregious NCAA violations occurred on Holtz' watch. While I personally don't think Holtz knew about the situation, the head coach is ultimately responsible for that sort of thing, and it was a real black eye for ND. In hindsight, by '96 Holtz would have been on borrowed time in a best-case scenario.

That having been said, two points are in order here. First, if Holtz had survived until '98, ND would have been in position for a serious national championship run that year. Jarious Jackson was probably the best QB ND ever had for Holtz' system -- basically Tony Rice with a better arm. Unfortunately for him, Bob Davie was ND's head coach by the time he was a starter.

Second, it's worth noting that ND had four DC's under Holtz, and the one who wound up succeeding him -- Bob Davie -- was the worst of the lot by a country mile. By contrast, the best of the group was Barry Alvarez. ND should have made a balls-to-the-wall pitch for him in '96, that would have made all the difference to the program since then.

[Killian]

Quick update, ND hired Jack Swarbrick as their new AD. I was ready to come on here and post a long winded tirade on how the new ND administration was no different than the old ND administration after Orsini announced he was staying at SMU. I'm glad I waited. This is a great hire, and he is the anti-White. Remindes me a lot of Bill Martin at UofM, who I think is an excellent AD.

Terry, I rarely disagree with you, but there were some things in this post that I can't get on board with.

Since you mentioned this . . .

That's one of my biggest pet peeves about ND Nation. Holtz is treated as some sort of demigod over there.

Holtz deserves credit for turning the program around following the Faust years, but that doesn't change the fact that he was a very imperfect coach as well. While I know this will sound like heresy to OU fan I was never a fan of Holtz' option offense, which I saw as already outdated by the time he got to ND. Holtz won at ND because he was an outstanding recruiter and master motivator who "got" ND well enough to win there. A brilliant offensive mind . . . not so much.

While Holtz was an imperfect coach, I disagree with him not being a brilliant offensive mind. Holtz didn't run a strict option offense in the vein of Navy or even Nebraska. He was more pro-set, I formation type of coach who would run option a few times a game to keep the defense honest. Worked a lot better with Tony Rice and Rick Mirer than Steve Buerline and Ron Powlus. Holtz's genius (in my opinion) was that he would line up and punch you in the mouth for 4 straight quarters. It might look like he was just running it into the line and then punting, but by the 4th quarter, ND was usually ripping off 8-10 yard runs because the opposing defense was worn out. Perfect example was Florida in the Sugar Bowl and FSU in '93. ND may not have been faster, but they physically kicked the shit out of those teams.

And in any hindsight analysis of Holtz' departure from ND, the Kimberly Dunbar situation has to be kept in mind. Granted, it's available only in hindsight, because it wasn't known in '96. But the most egregious NCAA violations occurred on Holtz' watch. While I personally don't think Holtz knew about the situation, the head coach is ultimately responsible for that sort of thing, and it was a real black eye for ND. In hindsight, by '96 Holtz would have been on borrowed time in a best-case scenario.

Agree and disagree. Near the end of his tenure, the inmates were running the asylum. On the other hand, the only thing that made that whore a booster was her $25 membership to the ND QB club. It was the first major infraction of any type for ND and it was agreed that they were going to get off very light. Instead, Monk bent over and waddled backwards towards the NCAA with his recomendations for sanctions. I don't think that was as damning as what happend on the Ireland trip with the cheerleaders and football players. For as good of a coach Holtz is, he burns himself out near the end of any of his stints.

That having been said, two points are in order here. First, if Holtz had survived until '98, ND would have been in position for a serious national championship run that year. Jarious Jackson was probably the best QB ND ever had for Holtz' system -- basically Tony Rice with a better arm. Unfortunately for him, Bob Davie was ND's head coach by the time he was a starter.

Second, it's worth noting that ND had four DC's under Holtz, and the one who wound up succeeding him -- Bob Davie -- was the worst of the lot by a country mile. By contrast, the best of the group was Barry Alvarez. ND should have made a balls-to-the-wall pitch for him in '96, that would have made all the difference to the program since then.

Completely agree about 1998. That was one of the weakest schedules in ND history, and Jackson would have been in his second year as a starter if Holtz were the coach. Add to that the fact that the '98 Tennessee team was a weak NC, ND had a great shot.

I disagree in part about Bob Davie. I hate that man, but he was a decent DC and a good LB coach. He was in way over his head as HC, but he wasn't even close to the worst DC Holtz had. That title belongs to Gary Darnell. He took a mini-NFL team in 1990 and some how had them lose 3 games. That defense had guys like Chris Zorich, Scott Kowolkowski, George Williams, Michael Stonebreaker, Todd Lyght, Andre Jones and others who all played in the NFL. First game against Michigan, a no name RB goes for over 200 yards. Tommy Vardell scores 3 or 4 TD's against ND for Stanford, and his defense collapsed down the stretch against Penn State. The next year wasn't any better with his choke job against Tennessee or PSU. Holtz fired him and ran the defense in the Sugar Bowl.

But back to the main point, Swabrick is a great hire. He's not part of the old boy's AD network, he won't look to parley this job into another, and he will negotiate from a position of strength and will represent ND in an honorable manor. None of which could have been said about Kevin White.

[Terry in Crapchester]

Terry, I rarely disagree with you, but there were some things in this post that I can't get on board with.

That having been said, two points are in order here. First, if Holtz had survived until '98, ND would have been in position for a serious national championship run that year. Jarious Jackson was probably the best QB ND ever had for Holtz' system -- basically Tony Rice with a better arm. Unfortunately for him, Bob Davie was ND's head coach by the time he was a starter.

Second, it's worth noting that ND had four DC's under Holtz, and the one who wound up succeeding him -- Bob Davie -- was the worst of the lot by a country mile. By contrast, the best of the group was Barry Alvarez. ND should have made a balls-to-the-wall pitch for him in '96, that would have made all the difference to the program since then.

Completely agree about 1998. That was one of the weakest schedules in ND history, and Jackson would have been in his second year as a starter if Holtz were the coach. Add to that the fact that the '98 Tennessee team was a weak NC, ND had a great shot.

I disagree in part about Bob Davie. I hate that man, but he was a decent DC and a good LB coach. He was in way over his head as HC, but he wasn't even close to the worst DC Holtz had. That title belongs to Gary Darnell. He took a mini-NFL team in 1990 and some how had them lose 3 games. That defense had guys like Chris Zorich, Scott Kowolkowski, George Williams, Michael Stonebreaker, Todd Lyght, Andre Jones and others who all played in the NFL. First game against Michigan, a no name RB goes for over 200 yards. Tommy Vardell scores 3 or 4 TD's against ND for Stanford, and his defense collapsed down the stretch against Penn State. The next year wasn't any better with his choke job against Tennessee or PSU. Holtz fired him and ran the defense in the Sugar Bowl.

You're right, I completely forgot about Darnell. Probably a defense mechanism on my part. I was subjected to him not only as ND's DC, but also when he was Florida's HC and I was living in Jacksonville and got it shoved down my throat by the local media all the time.

I was thinking about Fazio, Alvarez, Minter and Davie as DC's under Holtz. Davie was the worst of that group. Overall, he was 4 out of 5.

Quick update, ND hired Jack Swarbrick as their new AD. I was ready to come on here and post a long winded tirade on how the new ND administration was no different than the old ND administration after Orsini announced he was staying at SMU. I'm glad I waited. This is a great hire, and he is the anti-White. Remindes me a lot of Bill Martin at UofM, who I think is an excellent AD.

. . .

But back to the main point, Swabrick is a great hire. He's not part of the old boy's AD network, he won't look to parley this job into another, and he will negotiate from a position of strength and will represent ND in an honorable manor. None of which could have been said about Kevin White.

When the story broke, I was out to dinner with my wife and daughter, so all I had to go on was ESPN's crawl. Not surprisingly, the WWL referred to him as "Indianapolis attorney Jack Swarbrick," creating the impression that this was some sort of off-the-wall hire. My first reaction was pretty much the same first reaction I had to the O'Leary hire: "Who?!?!"

But then I did a little research on him. I found out that he had been President of the Indiana Sports Corporation, and that he had been considered for the AD positions at Arizona State, Indiana, and even Ohio State. Not looking like such a strange hire anymore.

Then I found out that, as chairman of the Indiana Sports Corporation, he had brokered a number of deals which, among other things: (a) brought a future Super Bowl to Indianapolis; (b) convinced the NCAA to move its headquarters to Indianapolis from the KC area; and (c) gave Indianapolis a sweetheart deal when it came to the NCAA basketball tournament (a future Final Four, and a 1st/2nd round or regional site for either the men's or women's tournament every other year for a number of years).

Swarbrick said all the right things at his press conference, but unlike most at ND Nation, I'm not inclined to read too much, good or bad, into a presser. Nor do I have the time available to parse the transcripts in such a painstaking manner as many of them do. When it comes to ND's athletic department, I'm more inclined to go along with something Rush said a few years back -- show me, don't tell me. There's plenty of work yet to be done. But given his background, and the deals he's already made, some of the deals he'll have to make for ND shouldn't be that hard to get done.

I was going to post a list of my expectations in some of the key areas for Swarbrick, but that would cause this post to approach Dinsdaleian lengths. I'll do that later.

As for White, this may sound crazy, but I really don't begrudge him shopping himself around. For whatever reasons, the Administration was extremely reluctant, at a minimum, to drop the hammer on him. And anybody viewing this objectively won't look at the move to Duke as a step up for him. For that matter, it's not even a lateral move, and Duke's basketball program is the only reason it even remotely approaches being in the same area code as a lateral move. If allowing him to save a little face was the price we had to pay to be rid of him, then it's a very small price to pay, imho.

As for Swarbrick, his background alone suggests, at a minimum, that he won't back into the negotiating table with his hands and pants around his ankles. After eight years of White, that alone would be a refreshing change of pace.