The West and other ramblings

[RadioFan]

In addition to the obvious three favorites (SA, PHX and Dallas), the Western Conference is looking very strong this year.

New Orleans is a solid team (they had flashes of it when they were in OKC) and with the stability now of a real home city, it looks like they are finally starting to making some noise. Utah was a darkhorse last year and is looking strong again this year. There's also a resurgent Portland team. (RACK that -- it's good for the NBA, imo) The Lakers also improved by obtaining Gasol, at least on paper. Then there's Houston and Golden State, both of which could be plenty dangerous to anybody in the first round, if both are healthy.

Obviously, there's lots of ball to be played, but the Western Conference playoffs this year are looking pretty fucking awesome -- perhaps the best in years -- at least on paper.

As for the Spurs, I was starting to get concerned when they blew another lead late and lost against Seattle the other night. Third loss in a row and 0-2 on their annual "rodeo road trip," which is 9 games this year. But the win last night in Pheonix -- without Parker and Barry -- and trailing by 4 with a minute left, was absolutely huge. If San Antonio is healthy by the time the playoffs start, they should be fine. At least until they have to play Dallas or Phoenix, which will also make playoff seedings this year very, very important.

Oh, and Dins -- You were right about Udoka. Dude's really starting to fit in. I like him, a LOT. Along those lines, I'm hoping Stoudamire doesn't fuck up my team's chemistry, even if he gets 20 a night. We'll see.


As for the East, I think everybody understands it's pretty much a two-team race, with the possible addition of Cleveland and Orlando. But the clear-cut favorite is Detroit, even if Boston has HC advantage in a potential EC Finals.

Unrack Dallas, btw. Not being able to beat Boston without Garnett? Jump-shot settling morons much? That was fairly pathetic.

Btw, I'm going to SA to see the Spurs play the Celtics on St. Patrick's Day. Amid margaritas, tex-mex, beer and watching them turn the river green, it should be a hella fun trip.

Out.

[Dinsdale]

In addition to the obvious... favorites (PHX)

BWAHAHAHA!!!!



Sorry RF, but you just got the same reaction from me that any analyst has in the last few years that's spouted that same bit of stupidity.

Hey, remember that one team that played absolutely ZERO freaking defense, and features two of the most feeble defensive players in the league who won the championship?


Yeah, I don't remember that, either.

No one in that crazy organization besides Steve Kerr, including their dumb fans, seems to understand that their current team will NEVER win it all. Not the en vogue thing to say, but Amare is just absolutely brutal on defense, which was on full display in the Spurs game... dude was barely even trying, and the next time he's in correct position on D will be the first time... just horrible. But it's quite possible he's a better defender than Nash -- someone should be indicted for fraud for that guy ever winning an MVP... what a joke. He's half a player. The most "efficient," electrifying offensive player in the game IMO, but damn... when he gaurds "the point" -- he really gaurds the point... and nowhere else. Kiki Vandeweigh was a better defensive player. Reggie Theus was a better defensive player. Dude just stands around while he expects the other 4 guys to do all the work... dude's the most likable "cancer" in history.

Utah was a darkhorse last year and is looking strong again this year. There's also a resurgent Portland team.

The Jizz are the Blazers' bitch this year.

Oh, and Dins -- You were right about Udoka. Dude's really starting to fit in. I like him, a LOT. Along those lines, I'm hoping Stoudamire doesn't fuck up my team's chemistry, even if he gets 20 a night. We'll see.

Dude, I didn't say "you'll probably like Ime" -- I said you'd LOVE Ime. It's impossible not to. Few players bring that level of intensity to the floor.

And despite what you've seen heard or know about Damon, despite all of his "issues" over the years -- dude will bring it. Actually, a Damon/Parker comparison isn't out of line -- quite similar players, but Parker is better at finishing in the lave, Damon is a much better outside shooter.

What the Spurs need to do after signing Damon, is trade for Fred Jones and Michael Doliac. If you're going to be running an all-Portland Boy backcourt, might as well get a set of them. It's a great way to win.

[RadioFan]

No one in that crazy organization besides Steve Kerr, including their dumb fans, seems to understand that their current team will NEVER win it all. Not the en vogue thing to say, but Amare is just absolutely brutal on defense, which was on full display in the Spurs game... dude was barely even trying, and the next time he's in correct position on D will be the first time... just horrible. But it's quite possible he's a better defender than Nash -- someone should be indicted for fraud for that guy ever winning an MVP... what a joke. He's half a player. The most "efficient," electrifying offensive player in the game IMO, but damn... when he gaurds "the point" -- he really gaurds the point... and nowhere else. Kiki Vandeweigh was a better defensive player. Reggie Theus was a better defensive player. Dude just stands around while he expects the other 4 guys to do all the work... dude's the most likable "cancer" in history.

I don't disagree with a lot of these points -- especially Amare's inability to guard Duncan. Phoenix did a great job of doubling Duncan the other night for most of the game. Hell, Jacque Vaughn was the leading scorer until Ginobili's free-throws at the end. Phoenix blew it guarding Duncan for the winning shot, thankfully. It was one of the few times all game that they fucked up.

The Suns had a really good chance to beat SA in last year's series, even with Stoudemire and Diaw's suspensions for Game 5. Hell, it took a Bruce Bowen 3 late for the Spurs to win that game. Had they not been suspended (for arguably a controversial letter-of-the-law "violation"), who knows what would have happened.

I really think this year will depend on the bracket and who everybody ends up playing, but they scare me more than Dallas, at least at present.

[Dinsdale]

The Suns had a really good chance to beat SA in last year's series, even with Stoudemire and Diaw's suspensions for Game 5. Hell, it took a Bruce Bowen 3 late for the Spurs to win that game. Had they not been suspended (for arguably a controversial letter-of-the-law "violation"), who knows what would have happened.

I know what would have happened -- Pop would have outcoached Seven Seconds Or Less (a member of the Blazer Family, but damn, what a feeble coach) badly. And this year, we know even more than we did then -- that Amare won'y even try to gaurd anyone, and that any big man with any knowledge of footwork can break down Amare on the block and get him to foul and have him sitting on the bench in no time. Geez, when I learned to play hoops as a kid, they really preached the "move your feet" thing. I guess I actually had to learn to play D since I'm not 6'11" and clowning junior high kids. Unfortunately for Amare, he appears unable to learn even the fundamentals now that he's an adult -- what shit-coaches he must have had as a kid.

And I'm guessing Kerr is working the phones like he's collecting donations for Jerry's Kids. While D'Antoni is good at the "head in the sand" approach, I'll bet Kerr is a little smarter than that, and is trying to get the complete lack of any sort of post defense adressed... and no, Diaw isn't the answer.

Until Phoenix finds some players who play D, they have no chance in a seven game series against the big dogs. Their stupid freaking offense isn't going to fare any better down the road, since they'll be dealing with Bynum and Oden and whatever other beasts come along in the West.


Heck, going out on a limb, but the current Blazers could give the Suns fits, and would quite possibly take them out in a seven game series... before you laugh, realize that the Blazers aren't going to play Phoenix' game -- the Blazers don't chase the most misleading stat in all of basketball...

The offensive rebound.


Give me a break... show me a team that puts up good offensive rebounding stats, and I'll show you a team that just lost to Phoenix by 30+.

Phoenix is built to KILL teams that crash the offensive boards.

The Blazers put no bodies on the offensive boards, and the only O-boards they get come on long ones, or 4th quarter desperation ones. They never box out. Because boxing out on the scoring end leads to Amare/Marion being on Sportcenter while your PG looks silly. And fast break points for whichever team you're playing.


Nate's team don't play that game -- shot goes up, 4 guys get back and get set. Pretty much the answer to Phoenix' gimmick.

But this season, the road to the West still goes through San Antonio. They're sandbagging. But dang, Duncan is sure starting to age quickly, as all big men eventually do, and very rarely with any grace. A little young for the inevitable big-man-suddenly-hits-the-wall, but he sure looks like he's getting to that point quickly. But until they chuck some dirt on his grave, I ain't betting against just yet.


Too bad so many people have such a bad attitude towards the NBA lately -- there's been some freaking awesome ball played in the last few weeks. If Stern can keep the refs from becoming the stars of the show (which is what drove people away in droves), it could be one of the more entertaining seasons in recent memory.

[RumpleForeskin]

The NBA seems to not be garnering much interest this year although the West is at its most competitive point for as long as I can remember. The addition of Boston being a contender obviously adds to the flavor of the East drawing some interest for reason other than a guy not named LeBron. Unfortunately, the Pistons just aren't marketable by any means. Sure, Rip Hamilton, and Billups are straight up ballers, but that slow tempo and defensive style is not easy on the eyes.

Lebron vs. the Celts in the Eastern conference finals makes for a very intriguing match. One that might draw higher ratings than the actual finals because it would be a lot to overcome beating the 3-headed monster that the Celts went out and bought this offseason. It would be a nice matchup to say the least. I think for the East to really get back to a shell of their glory days, New York is the x-factor. They need to be competitive in order for that conference to snatch away some of the attention the West is receiving.

As for the West, its a coin toss between 10 teams. T-Mac said he is feeling a lot better, so now the Rockets can be taken seriously again. Chris Paul is just sick. Reminds me of a smaller Magic or Isiah in their hay days. Brandon Roy and Aldridge for Portland is what the West really needed. Postland's success is good for the NBA because they are an NBA first town. Aldridge just needs to find that next level of aggression and he can be great. Golden St. is a shower and that is it. They will entertain and keep you interested, but won't do anything more than that. Denver will always be that scary team with all the talent, but with no inside presence, they are just less loaded version of the run-n-gun Suns. Nash and Amare will get a lot of Ws, but with no physical game in the paint, they will get beat because of lack of size and defensive strategy. San Antonio seems to have lost a step or maybe all the other teams are just that much better this year. I think its a little of both. Dallas, you could say the same. I think Dirk might be slowing down a bit and other teams are now catching on with how to beat them. Go small and run. Utah is Utah. They are good. Probably the best in the league as far as balance goes. They are just missing that one more physical player underneath to help Boozer. Also, Darren Williams is great at penetrating, but he can't finish as well as McGrady, Kobe, Roy, etc. He needs someone to dish to other than Boozer to finish those plays. Lakers have Gasol which is great, but they still gotta make it work. They are also missing the 3-point shot. Fisher isn't enough. I think they are missing enough of the outside presence to get respect from defenders to guard out a little farther along the perimeter.

My .02

[Dinsdale]

it would be a lot to overcome beating the 3-headed monster that the Celts went out and bought this offseason.

Yeah, I mean... all those times Garnett lifted his teams on his shoulders and they overachieved... and all of those deeeeeep playoff runs that were strictly a result of Ray Allen chucking nthe rock mercilessly... and Pierced... his resume speaks for itself.

:rolleypolley:

Dude, it's three career died-in-the-wool stats-grabbing LOSERS. Confirmed freaking losers. Decade-deep losers.

New York is the x-factor. They need to be competitive in order for that conference to snatch away some of the attention the West is receiving.

The DickerSuckers played their best game of the season without Curry and Richardson here in Portland the other night. And Zach's "homecoming" was a nice side-story. The Pricks played very well, and were straight-up ballin'.

They still fell victim to Mr. Roy, of course, but they played a good game.

A triple-double to remind everyone why Randolph (BOOOOOO!!!!!!!... while Freddy Jones was getting standing ovations... RACK it) was traded was nice.

Aldridge just needs to find that next level of aggression and he can be great.

As Blazermaniacs, we were thinking baby steps might be cool... like LMA making a shot in the second half of a game might be a good start.

Denver will always be that scary team with all the talent, but with no inside presence, they are just less loaded version of the run-n-gun Suns.

Uhm... hey, Rumps?

Did you happen to notice that last year's Defensive MVP was the center for the Noogs?


Ever heard of a guy named Kenyon Martin?

Nene Hidalgo ring any bells (oooh -- there's a tasteless joke in there somewhere, if you can find it)?

Utah is Utah. They are good. Probably the best in the league as far as balance goes.

"Balance"? I don't think 1-3 against division-rival Portland was quite the "balance" they were looking for.

I think they[Lakers] are missing enough of the outside presence to get respect from defenders to guard out a little farther along the perimeter.

Yeah, but their Euro perimeter players are getting more in tune with the team all the time. Maybe Gasol will bridge the gap between Euro-ball and NBA ball... you never know.

[Diogenes]

No one in that crazy organization besides Steve Kerr, including their dumb fans, seems to understand that their current team will NEVER win it all. Not the en vogue thing to say, but Amare is just absolutely brutal on defense, which was on full display in the Spurs game... dude was barely even trying, and the next time he's in correct position on D will be the first time... just horrible. But it's quite possible he's a better defender than Nash -- someone should be indicted for fraud for that guy ever winning an MVP... what a joke. He's half a player. The most "efficient," electrifying offensive player in the game IMO, but damn... when he gaurds "the point" -- he really gaurds the point... and nowhere else. Kiki Vandeweigh was a better defensive player. Reggie Theus was a better defensive player. Dude just stands around while he expects the other 4 guys to do all the work... dude's the most likable "cancer" in history.

I don't disagree with a lot of these points -- especially Amare's inability to guard Duncan. Phoenix did a great job of doubling Duncan the other night for most of the game. Hell, Jacque Vaughn was the leading scorer until Ginobili's free-throws at the end. Phoenix blew it guarding Duncan for the winning shot, thankfully. It was one of the few times all game that they fucked up.

I don't hold an inability to guard Duncan against Amare. Nobody can one-on-one. I would like them to get a center to replace Kurt Thomas and put Amare at forward, but I'm fine with what they have going now. Adding Hill was a great move, BTW. As far as defense...

Suns Notebook: Solid Defense Inspires Suns

Posted: Feb 2 2008 12:22PM
By Matt Paulson
eastvalleytribune.com,
Feb. 2, 2008


Despite the freshness of the stinging loss to the San Antonio Spurs on Thursday night, the theme in the Suns locker room afterward centered more around what went right rather than what went wrong.

“I thought our defense was very good,” said coach Mike D’Antoni, who gave his players Friday off. “We just couldn’t get anything offensively going and if that’s our problem, that’s not a bad problem to have. We’ll solve that.”

By holding the Spurs to 38.7 percent shooting from the field, Phoenix extended its streak of keeping an opponent under 40 percent to three games. Over that span, the opposition has shot a combined 35.7 percent, well below the Suns’ defensive season average of 45.0.

That effort has resulted in holding their opponents to under 100 points in seven of their last 10 games.

Add to those numbers the fact that in the past two contests Phoenix has established season bests for steals (13), opponent field-goal percentage (34.3), first-half points by an opponent (33) and a franchise record for blocks in a game (19), and the Suns are well on their way to having their best defensive season under D’Antoni.

“That’s the thing we really want to build on,” guard Steve Nash said.

Improvement in this area isn’t just a recent trend. Phoenix is blocking shots at the second-best rate in the league (7.10 to Denver’s 7.15) and is on track to swat a franchise-best 583, one more than the previous high set in 1991-92. (Edit-I believe their BS differential is actually #1) Additionally, the Suns are second in the league to Boston (31.2) in opponent 3-point field-goal percentage (33.2).

“I’m pretty encouraged,” D’Antoni said, “just because of our defense and stuff we know we have to get better at, we were pretty good at.”

[RadioFan]

Too bad so many people have such a bad attitude towards the NBA lately -- there's been some freaking awesome ball played in the last few weeks. If Stern can keep the refs from becoming the stars of the show (which is what drove people away in droves), it could be one of the more entertaining seasons in recent memory.

Rack that.

Btw, Rumps ...

As for the West, its a coin toss between 10 teams.

Best laugh I've had in a while.

T-Mac said he is feeling a lot better, so now the Rockets can be taken seriously again.

Oh, OK.

Bwah!


Dio, I've always liked D’Antoni. Seems like a class dude. The TNT announcers were talking a lot about how Phoenix has improved their defense. They have a long way to go before they reach the level of SA or Detroit, but they did a hell of a good job on Duncan the other night.

[RumpleForeskin]

RF,

Care to elaborate how some teams are head and shoulders above others from 1-10 in the West?

The fact that only 6 games separate the top 10 teams in the West tells me that there is not one team that can be considered a clear-cut favorite in the playoffs. Sure, we can speculate that San Antonio can take 4 out of 5 from Golden St., but thats all it is....speculating. Nobody knows what is going to happen between now and the end of the season.

[Dinsdale]

Oh, OK. I guess if Master Of All Things Defense D'Antoni says Phoenix is playing good defense, it must be true.


Either that, or they caught a couple of teams on off shooting nights :bigfatrolleyes:


Speaking of... someone should tell Atlanta's maintainence crew that you're supposed to loosen up the rims that your team is shooting at in the second half. That was funny shit -- the Blazers were shooting at the big "KA-THUNK" rim in the second half. I guess they've been down so long, they've forgotten how to cheat. It's a dumb strategy anyway.


Actually, I hadn't really seen the inequally adjusted rims thing until the Blazers went on their big East trip. The rims were screwed in Toronto, Boston, and ATL. I don't recall seeing that in any other buildings to that point. Maybe they only do it to Western teams, to even the "balance of power."

And if they leave those rims too lose, Travis Outlaw is going to break one... not bad for a guy who weighs about a buck-eighty at 6'10". Heaven forbid what Greggy could do to one of those... dude is looking like Adonis these days-btw. They booted him out of the weight room, he was bulking up so quickly. Freaking specimen.

[Dinsdale]

Well, I guess we can start tossing dirt on the Nash Era.


Does Steve Kerr really hate D'Antoni that much, and does he really hate Marion's whining that much?

I could understand trading Marion for Shaq if there was cap relief involved (see the other thread, Dio). But there isn't. It's actually taking on more burden for Phoenix, unless Kerr is thinking buyout (which would have been MUCH easier with Marion).


Before yesterday, if anyone asked me who the absolute worst player in the NBA who Phoenix could have traded for, I would have said "Shaq" with little hesitation.


And I'll be damned.


Matrix must have REALLY pissed someone off. It's the only possible explaination. This team just got soooo much worse, it's crazy -- even more crazy since they are #1 in the West at present (but won't be in another week or so).


Complete madness. I wonder if Kerr has a tumor or something?


Sure, rumor has it that Marion HATES Amare (can't say I blame him -- Marion plays hard defense, Amare plays none... hard to respect a guy like that). But to make that sort of deal to get rid of your best defensive player, on a bad defensive team, is just plain nuts. Although logistically difficult, I wonder if Kerr isn't trying to make other deals... which means he's blowing that ill-conceived team up... but to do so at this point, with the team in first place, is just mind-boggling. Sure, it needs to have a fork stuck in it, but to do so now, without even trying for one more playoff run in 3 months...


Wow. I figured Miami would try and unload Shaq before the deadline, but I didn't think any contender would bite. That's one hell of a sweet deal for Miami -- a dream come true deal. Any time a GM does that for another team, there's something seriously wrong within, behind those closed doors.


I suppose we should start calling them "22 Seconds Or Less" now?


Shocked over here.

[RumpleForeskin]

Agreed. Terrible fucking move here by Kerr. I suppose the Phoenix Suns will be releasing a second presser about newly installed defibrillators on all 4 corners of the court just in case the big man goes down when Nash wants to push it.

They might not make the playoffs now.

[Dinsdale]

I hear ya.

Obviously, there was a lot more going on behind those closed doors than any of us could have possibly imagined. This wasn't a roster improvement move for Phoenix by any stretch of the imagination, which means it was probably some sort of cancer surgery.

[Diogenes]

I don't hold an inability to guard Duncan against Amare. Nobody can one-on-one. I would like them to get a center to replace Kurt Thomas and put Amare at forward,

Be careful what you wish for...

Shaq Headed for Suns?
By BOB BAUM – 1 hour ago

PHOENIX (AP) — The fastest, flashiest team in the NBA could be getting a lot slower — but much larger — because of a blockbuster trade few could have seen coming.

The improbable pairing of the Phoenix Suns and Shaquille O'Neal went from rumor to near-reality overnight. The last major roadblock was the 14-time All-Star center passing a physical. A league official, speaking on condition of anonymity, told The Associated Press the deal could be complete Wednesday.

"The process is in play, and that's all I really can say because things have backed up before," Miami Heat coach Pat Riley said Wednesday in Auburn Hills, Mich., where his team was preparing for the Pistons. "Nothing's been completed, and that's where it's at right now."

The deal would send unhappy forward Shawn Marion and guard Marcus Banks to the Heat.

"I don't have any reaction yet because I don't know the truth yet," Heat guard Dwyane Wade said Wednesday morning. "So until the truth comes out, I can't really react to it."

The trade would signal an unexpected change in philosophy for the Suns, adding a 7-foot-1, 325-pound center who has won four NBA championships but has been plagued by injuries in recent years and turns 36 next month. O'Neal has been out with a hip injury and underwent an MRI exam in Miami on Tuesday.

For the three-plus seasons since Steve Nash came to town, Phoenix and its ultra up-tempo style have been the frenetic darlings of NBA fans grown weary of the slow style that has prevailed for years. But the Suns have fallen short in the playoffs, never making it to the finals.

Marion, unhappy being third fiddle to Nash and Amare Stoudemire, asked to be traded before the season began. Stoudemire, meanwhile, dislikes playing out of position at center. The Suns have the best record in the West (34-14) but have not played up to their own or fans' expectations.

On Tuesday night, the Suns pushed back their scheduled shootaround on Wednesday from 9:45 a.m. MST to 4:45 p.m., shortly before they face the New Orleans Hornets.

O'Neal is prepared for a trade, a confidant of his told The AP on Tuesday night.

His associate, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to reveal anything publicly, said a deal could be imminent.

O'Neal didn't speak to reporters before leaving Miami's practice Tuesday and did not accompany the Heat to Detroit. He was expected in Phoenix on Wednesday for a physical.

"I'm not going to talk about it," Riley said. "If in fact things get completed, because there's so much more, then there'll be an official comment about it. Right now, there's nothing but hypotheticals."

Suns general manager Steve Kerr, owner Robert Sarver and coach Mike D'Antoni did not return messages left on their cell phones by the AP.

Speaking Tuesday night on his weekly radio show on Sports 620 KTAR, D'Antoni professed to know nothing about such a deal. However, he said such an acquisition would "mean a lot."

"That's a big question that has to be thought over and pondered," he said.

If Shaq came back to the Pacific Division, he would join a team that has an intense rivalry with the Los Angeles Lakers and O'Neal's old teammate Kobe Bryant.

"Really?" Bryant said when told of the apparently pending deal. "I know he likes the warm weather."

The trade would require a significant financial commitment from the budget-conscious Sarver because O'Neal is scheduled to make $20 million this season and $20 million more each of the next two.

Marion could opt out of the $17 million final year of his contract after this season.

O'Neal entered this season talking about how he wanted to win at least one more title, saying his "legacy" wouldn't be complete unless he left the game with at least five rings.

The Heat, though, have lost 19 of their last 20 games and have the NBA's worst record at 9-37.

"This is the NBA. I'm not really surprised by anything that happens," Wade said. "I'm not surprised by anything that's said."

O'Neal, averaging a career-low 14.2 points per game, is going through a divorce, and his scoring average is nearly 11 1/2 points below his 25.6 career mark. His string of 14 All-Star appearance ended this season.

He missed much of the 2006-07 season with a knee injury and finished that year with career-lows in games (40), scoring (17.3 points), rebounds (7.4), minutes (28.4) and free-throw percentage (.422).

AP Sports Writer Tim Reynolds in Miami contributed to this report.


http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5jGzW ... AD8UKU3AO0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So Maxrix wants to leave, can go at the end of the season, and has a 17 mil contract. Shaq adds another 3 mil.

Plus we lose Banks. That's going to hurt.

This is abuot shoring up the D. The reason Amare's Defense hasn't been up to par is simple. He's Not A Fucking Center. He was great on both ends when they had Thomas to play center and he could play at his natural position. I'll have to wait and see, (and O'Neal isn't the center I'd have picked) but this could work out in the short term. The only question is does he slow them down on offense (or give them more rebounds (their worst defensive stat) and more fast breaks)? And can he stay healthy.

Stay tuned.

[bbqjones]

marion has been unhappy in phoenix for 2plus years. he has been the best all-around player the suns probably ever had. but apparently he doesnt like being second or as it is, third fiddle on that team. kindof like when joe johnson was gonzo. he would rather be the man on a shitty atlanta team than score only 18 a game. im not too sure what to think of the trade except it does move amare to the 4 and hopefully keeps him out of foul trouble for a couple games. shaq isnt going to play any more than 20-24 minutes anyways. might be a good break when nash is taking his 5 minute rest at the start of every quarter. slow it down some and , shit, even i cant pretend this is a good trade. although the monies will be pretty much the same marion (17mil) banks 3mil. marion is probably one of the top 5 most underrated players in the league. i hate to see him go, but ill be sure to brag on when hes averaging 27per for a shitty heat team.

[bbqjones]

i swear i wrote all that before i saw dio post.

[Diogenes]

The point is Marion was gone anyway. We basicly gave up next to nothing in the long run, and in the short term got someone who just might help out the D and will take pressure off of Amare. No real downside here, Matrix is great but we have plenty of depth at forward.

[Diogenes]

I swear I wrote all that after I saw BBQ post.

[Raydah James]

Lakerfan is wholeheartedly laughing thier asses off right now.


You got Shaq to shore up your D? Really?

Newsflash, dumbfucks: Shaq barely played any D when he was in his fucking prime unless the game was on the line.....and even then, he became a liability due to his shit free throw percentage. Up next comes the suppossed "double team" factor that Suntard will lean on to make this horrifically funny trade easier to swallow-except that the west is so damn loaded with Big Man talent that a "double team" wont be needed to check that fat piece of old creaky shit. Duncan and Bynum (and maybe even Oden) will need absolutely no collapsing help on an immobile, out of shape Shaq who can barely reach the basket to dunk any longer. In fact, Bynum is so much faster, and is such a monster on D that Lakerfan will be hoping for a semi's/WCF matchup so that we can see Bynum break the shot block record and abuse O'Neal on a national stage.


Excellent work, suns-you managed to ship off a guy who fits perfectly in your run 'n' gun system and was a major component and contributor to it.....as well as your best defensive player for a 36 year old out of shape slug who'll be winded by the end of the first fucking quarter if he attempts to run with your team. Even in a half-court set, the guy is unwatchably bad and throws up brick after brick after brick. His slow ass post 'moves' dont fucking surprise anyone anymore-and are usually met with a block, airball, or clanker. Lowest point total in his career the last 2 years out front should've told you.





Lakerfan is licking thier chops at the thought of meeting up with the Suns in the playoffs (If Duncan and the Spurts dont knock you out first)-because its going to get ugly. Real fucking ugly.

[Raydah James]

The point is Marion was gone anyway. We basicly gave up next to nothing in the long run, and in the short term got someone who just might help out the D and will take pressure off of Amare. No real downside here, Matrix is great but we have plenty of depth at forward.

Yeah, you lost nothing.



How many points per game was your best defensive player averaging again? Im guessing its more than a broken down sorry ass old player in Patrick Ewing 2 (without the jumpshot ability)


If this is the best your shit GM (who is being roasted on radio as I speak for this) can do with a player like Marion, then the rest of the West will continue to have nothing to worry about if it involves the name 'Phoenix Suns'

[Diogenes]

The point is Marion was gone anyway. We basicly gave up next to nothing in the long run, and in the short term got someone who just might help out the D and will take pressure off of Amare. No real downside here, Matrix is great but we have plenty of depth at forward.

Yeah, you lost nothing.

Learn to read, bitch.

[Dinsdale]

Oh, dear.

Dude, when I say "Dio, you really don't know fucking shit about the business side of the NBA," you shouldn't jump up to the rooftops to confirm it.


Don't ever say I didn't try and help you not look like a complete dumbfuck in the future, because I did exactly that -- and you ignored it, and decided to be an even bigger dumbfuck... that takes a special kind of stupid, dude.

We basicly gave up next to nothing in the long run

Fuckin'A dude, I explained that whole "salary cap" thingy to you.

Marion had one year left after this one on his deal, and if he was truly that unhappy, he could have opted out, making his contract done.


Shaq has two more years left at 20 mil a year.



So, you fucking moron, how do you figure that somewhere between $40-$57 million in salary alone is "next to nothing"? That's just the salaries -- Phoenix is over the cap, so you're looking at probably another 20 million beyond that, without even paying a star's salary.


Looking at possibly $75 million freaking dollars. That's not "next to nothing" even to an NBA franchise.


And with your obvious ignorance of the business, it would probably be a waste to try and explain that the Suns just signed on for at least one extra year of maxed-out payroll, and therefore will probably be unable to sign anyone, and has doomed the team to at least 2.5 more years of failure.


There's only one explaination -- Marion REALLY pissed someone the fuck off. That's the ONLY plausable explaination.



This is the worst trade in recent memory. Western Conference foes who once feared the Suns come playoff time are now laughing. The entire basketball world has been shocked by Kerr's brain-dead move... even if his hand was forced (GOT to be more to the story than we're hearing... HAS to be... this is a suicidal "X's and O's" move).


While not too mabny people were giving the Suns much of a chance at winning the West, at least they had a chance. That chance just went out the window in one fell swoop.


The Suns need to start salary-dumping at the end of this season... which makes the Shaq trade even more asinine. Blow that team up and throw some dirt on its grave. Fuck, they've even been trading away their first rounders (not that they were high first rounders, but when you have no young core, those picks become quite valuable).


So not only did Kerr kill any short term hope for Phoenix, he just doomed them to several years of futility. Just an absolutely shocking move. And I've always been a big Kerr fan, too... dig the guy.


And Dio is too punch-drunk at the moment to even start ridiculing him for "Amare only sucks at the 5." Yeah, buddy -- that's the reason Amare throws out even the most basic fundamentals of rec-league defense... because it's not his "natural position." It's perfectly acceptable to be completely out of position, put forth no effort, and to not move your feet and follow your man on defense if you feel you're not being played at your "natural position." I mean, that's what "professionals" who are motivated to win a championship behind their MVP, right? They don't do the things that high school kids need to do to stay on the floor.


I don't know who looks more fucking stupid right now -- Dio or Kerr.

[Dinsdale]

It appears the national media is scrtaching their heads over this one, too.

It's essentially walking-papers for D'Antoni.

And now Nash is burdened by having to warm up to a guy who called his MVP awards "tainted."


Steve Kerr has failed on so many levels, his job might end up in danger if this deal turns out to be the disaster everyone thinks it will be. Not sure how that works with Kerr being part-owner, but I'm sure there's a legal contingency for it.


The Suns went from being entertaining on the floor to entertaining off the floor. Not quite the entertainment upgrade a franchise is looking for, but it works for me.

[RumpleForeskin]

At least the Kobe/Shaq thing will get the NBA juices flowing for the impartial fans. This will get driven to the ground by the likes of every major media outlet should these two teams meet in the first round.

[Dinsdale]

Except Shaq would get clowned in that "matchup."


And over the last 15 years, if we've learned anything about Shaq, it's this -- the guy will put no effort into ANYTHING that isn't handed to him on a silver platter.

We're talking about a guy who backed out of his LOI when he found out Dean Smith actually wanted him to practice and learn stuff.

If the Suns face the Lakes, I'm calling my shot already -- "oh, Ow! My hip/toe/knee/whichever mystery ailment it is this week won't allow me to play... but I really want to."


For $25 mil a year, dude couldn't be bothered to work out in the offseason, and his body and teammates have paid severely for it.

[RadioFan]

At least the Kobe/Shaq thing will get the NBA juices flowing for the impartial fans. This will get driven to the ground by the likes of every major media outlet should these two teams meet in the first round.

Hopefully, Phoenix plays LA in the 1st round of the WC playoffs, with the winner playing Dallas in the semis. :twisted:

But I digress ...

While both Dio and Dins cracked me up in this, and other threads ... there's still, oh, let's see ...









About 35 games left, in the regular season.








































Did I mention, at the start of this thread, that the Western Conference playoffs, this year, had the potential to be better than in many, many years?

Let's see what happens, shall we?

With BOTH the Lummox AND Gasol.

Carry on ...

[Diogenes]

... there's still, oh, let's see ...









About 35 games left, in the regular season.

Did I mention, at the start of this thread, that the Western Conference playoffs, this year, had the potential to be better than in many, many years?

Let's see what happens, shall we?

Agreed. Of course, I'm not one of the geniuses predicting how the season is going to turn out before the all-star break (*or before Shaq plays his first game as a Sun)...

So Maxrix wants to leave, can go at the end of the season, and has a 17 mil contract. Shaq adds another 3 mil.

Plus we lose Banks. That's going to hurt.

This is abuot shoring up the D. The reason Amare's Defense hasn't been up to par is simple. He's Not A Fucking Center. He was great on both ends when they had Thomas to play center and he could play at his natural position. I'll have to wait and see, (and O'Neal isn't the center I'd have picked) but this could work out in the short term. The only question is does he slow them down on offense (or give them more rebounds (their worst defensive stat) and more fast breaks)? And can he stay healthy.

Stay tuned.

The point is Marion was gone anyway. We basicly gave up next to nothing in the long run, and in the short term got someone who just might help out the D and will take pressure off of Amare. No real downside here, Matrix is great but we have plenty of depth at forward.

I just can see where Kerr and D'Antoni are going, can see the potential upside, and am waiting to see what happens.

Like I said before:

Stay Tuned.

[RumpleForeskin]

The Rockets are 16-3 since Jan 4 and have gained only 1 spot on the West. That is unbelieveable. Luckily, the schedule is still on the soft side for the next couple of weeks. They should be able to gain some spots at some point if they can keep this pace.