Corvette C8

[FiatLux]

https://www.chevrolet.com/upcoming-vehi ... corvette




I'm blown away. The mid-engine is finally here, and its glorious!

[Joe in PB]

Pretty cool alright.

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[FiatLux]

Pretty cool alright.

The Mid-Engine C8 Corvette Has 495 HP and Hits 60 MPH In Under 3.0 Seconds


https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/ ... os-specs/





Tesla who ?

[smackaholic]

It's a tad busy looking. Side view looks nicer than that front quarter view. I am sure it will be badass though.

Are they sticking with the LS? The only reason they did in the past is that the pushrod motor is extremely compact. A DOHC would have never fit under the hood. That shouldn't be an issue with a midengine layout.

[smackaholic]

So, they are sticking with the pushrod motor, although it is a new one. I suspect you'll see a DOHC motor within a few years. GM makes an excellent 3.6 V-6. Would make an even better 4.8 V-8. Give it twin turbos and it'll blow the 6.2 away.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

A DOHC would have never fit under the hood.

Sure it could. We're not talking about your grandpa's blocks...Why would you think it couldn't be scaled to the Vette's V8?

[Dinsdale]

We're not talking about your grandpa's blocks

Uhm... with the LS motors... yeah, we pretty much are talking about your grandpa's blocks. Beyond the aluminum, it's pretty much the same as the old school small block Chev.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

Okay, fair enough.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

Impressive torque rating though...

[Left Seater]

Nice car. Prolly beats my G-6 in the quarter mile. But that’s all. I got it beat in the mile, 5 mile, 10 mile, 100 mile, 1000 mile and 5000 mile.

Top end speed on that car is probably pretty impressive...until you get to that stop sign.

[Joe in PB]

The C8 isn't anything like the previous versions. It's more sports car than muscle car. It will compete directly with Porche, Ferrari, the Ford GT, etc. It's specialty will be road courses and I'm sure it will be a lot of fun. The least expensive version might be quite a bargain compared to the cars I mentioned above.

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[smackaholic]

The C8 isn't anything like the previous versions. It's more sports car than muscle car. It will compete directly with Porche, Ferrari, the Ford GT, etc. It's specialty will be road courses and I'm sure it will be a lot of fun. The least expensive version might be quite a bargain compared to the cars I mentioned above.

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Dude, the C-7 was already competing with and in many cases beating the Euros at their own game. The C-7 was already a world class sports car.

[smackaholic]

We're not talking about your grandpa's blocks

Uhm... with the LS motors... yeah, we pretty much are talking about your grandpa's blocks. Beyond the aluminum, it's pretty much the same as the old school small block Chev.

The LS followed the SBC architecture, but it is lightyears ahead of it. The wizards at GM have gotten way moer than they ever should of out of an OHV pushrod V-8. It has full variable time with both intake and exhaust. How the fukk they pull that off from a single cam is beyond me. Dudes aer straight up witches. Rack them.

That being said, 3 more cams and 16 more valves would allow them to do more.

My prediction is they will bring a 32v DOHC twin turbo to the table before long. They will also use a flywheel/electric motor to fill in the torque hole that comes with turbo motors. MB is doing it with their new inline 6. I suspect that this system which does away with the starter and alternator will become standard on all vehicles before long. Honda used it with their first gen Insight over 20 years ago.

[smackaholic]

A DOHC would have never fit under the hood.

Sure it could. We're not talking about your grandpa's blocks...Why would you think it couldn't be scaled to the Vette's V8?

No it wouldn't.

DOHC engines are superior to pushrod engines but they are not as compact. The heads on a DOHC engine are huge compared to the pushrod head.

This was pointed out in an article I read years ago where the chief engineer for the Corvette was being interviewed. He sited it when asked why Chevy had stuck with a pushrod motor so long.

[Joe in PB]

There's a reason Chevy has a new mid engine design on the C8, and it's not because the C7 dominated road courses.

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[smackaholic]

A good question would be why does dodge stick with pushrods? All of the cars they put it into are barges. A DOHC plant would fit no problem.

I suspect the answer to that question is "HEMI!!!!" and "'MURICUH".

[Joe in PB]

Dodge makes muscle cars, the C8 is a sports car.

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[smackaholic]

There's a reason Chevy has a new mid engine design on the C8, and it's not because the C7 dominated road courses.

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The C7 represented itself very well road racing.

Will the C8 be even better?

Sure.

But I think there is a better reason it is mid-engine.

Ferraris and Lamborghinis are.

The C7's real world handling limits were already way beyond all amateur drivers on the track and beyond even pro drivers on public roads.

[smackaholic]

Dodge makes muscle cars, the C8 is a sports car.

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No argument there, but your earlier statement kind of implied the C7 was a muscle car. I disagree. It was every bit the sports car, by any accepted definition.

The point I was making was that physical size was not a limitation and could very well have made their Challenger/Charger DOHC. It would have fit under the hood. A DOHC V-8 of any decent displacement, would not have fit under the hood of the vette.

[Joe in PB]

The C7 really is a hybrid with it's front end heavy high torque push rod motor. It can drag race & road race but not easily as you stated. The C8 in a lot of ways is likely Chevy's answer to the Ford GT, which has a 647 hp 550 lb ft of torque 3.5 liter v6. Unfortunately Ford made few of them and they were lottery only, going for half a million plus. That's why I think the C8 could be a bargin for someone looking for similar performance. BTW the Ford GT handles much better with the v6 as opposed to having a v8. It will probably take Chevy a few years to dial the C8 in.

Good discussion.

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[FiatLux]

https://carbuzz.com/news/1000-hp-c8-cor ... own-frames

It bends it's frame. I don't know if they've fixed that now, but that's not exactly something that a logical person would want to fuck with.

Porky is straight up the dumbest poster ever on this board. (We've all heard his interview with Smackie}

If Porky has me on "ignore" and posts... on a thread I started... ?

Ah fuck it,


too funny !

[FiatLux]

https://carbuzz.com/news/1000-hp-c8-cor ... own-frames

It bends it's frame. I don't know if they've fixed that now, but that's not exactly something that a logical person would want to fuck with.

Saw a Chevrolet Canyon with a pretty bent up frame as well.

Hard to imagine that the Corvette doesn't have an aluminum or carbon frame. Those would be much stiffer than steel.

unreal

[smackaholic]

So, they are sticking with the pushrod motor, although it is a new one. I suspect you'll see a DOHC motor within a few years. GM makes an excellent 3.6 V-6. Would make an even better 4.8 V-8. Give it twin turbos and it'll blow the 6.2 away.

Twin turbos are not as efficient as a larger single turbo. You can still run a V motor with twin turbo just have the exhaust side on the inner part of the V and then run a 60+ psi turbo like the old CART or F1 turbo charged cars


I may need to add a 2nd Corvette to my collection after seeing that one. It'll look nice in the garage next to the '67 427 Stingray

A single turbo might be fine if they use the "hot V" layout (exhaust ports to the inside of the V. Mercedes does this now. It eliminates quite a bit of exhaust plumbing. Also, turbo lag isn't an issue if they use a hybrid setup. You simply slam the electric motor for a moment to provide the torque while the turbo builds boost.

I really do think Mercedes new hybrid inline 6 is the future of ICEs, until we figure battery technology to the point where ICEs make no sense. That could be within the next decade.

[smackaholic]

So, they are sticking with the pushrod motor, although it is a new one. I suspect you'll see a DOHC motor within a few years. GM makes an excellent 3.6 V-6. Would make an even better 4.8 V-8. Give it twin turbos and it'll blow the 6.2 away.

Twin turbos are not as efficient as a larger single turbo. You can still run a V motor with twin turbo just have the exhaust side on the inner part of the V and then run a 60+ psi turbo like the old CART or F1 turbo charged cars


I may need to add a 2nd Corvette to my collection after seeing that one. It'll look nice in the garage next to the '67 427 Stingray

A single turbo might be fine if they use the "hot V" layout (exhaust ports to the inside of the V). Mercedes does this now. It eliminates quite a bit of exhaust plumbing. Also, turbo lag isn't an issue if they use a hybrid setup. You simply slam the electric motor for a moment to provide the torque while the turbo builds boost.

I really do think Mercedes new hybrid inline 6 is the future of ICEs, until we figure battery technology to the point where ICEs make no sense. That could be within the next decade.

[smackaholic]

There is one disappointing fact. It won't have a third pedal, as God intended all sports cars to have.

https://jalopnik.com/get-over-it-the-c8 ... 1836639481

I understand why. Autos are soooooo fukking good today and developing a manual option just can't be justified economically.

But it still sucks.

I am of the opinion that a manual puts the sport in sports car. What I would really like to see is someone come up with a real manual, with a clutch pedal, that could be have an auto mode. It wouldn't be that difficult, given modern control systems. This way you could work on your heel and toe technique on Saturday at the track and still make the rush hour slog into the office on monday without Having your clutch leg fall off.

[Dinsdale]

I suspect that this system which does away with the starter and alternator will become standard on all vehicles before long. Honda used it with their first gen Insight over 20 years ago.

You mean the "true hybrid"concept they straight ripped-off from Toyota?

[smackaholic]

Toyota's Prius Hybrid system uses a planetary gear setup allowing electric, gas or a combination drive. To the best of my knowledge, the rest of Toyota's hybrid lineup employs a similar system.

The Benz system eliminates the alternator and starter motor. In its place is a pancake electric motor/generator. It is a 48 volt system. The AC is electric drive as is the power steering and water pump. This means no aux drive belts at all at the front of the engine. The result is a very short inline 6. If it is a rip-off of anyone, I guess it would be Honda, who used a similar motor between the crank and the flywheel in the G1 Insight, 20 years ago.

Apparently, MB is going all in on this system and will be eliminating the V-6 from their lineup.

You are going to see a lot of this motor/generator, higher voltage sort of thing in the future. It eliminates many parts, shortens the engine, gives mild hybrid capability and makes cars increasingly more complex electrical systems lighter and more efficient.

[smackaholic]

There is one disappointing fact. It won't have a third pedal, as God intended all sports cars to have.

https://jalopnik.com/get-over-it-the-c8 ... 1836639481

I understand why. Autos are soooooo fukking good today and developing a manual option just can't be justified economically.

But it still sucks.

I am of the opinion that a manual puts the sport in sports car. What I would really like to see is someone come up with a real manual, with a clutch pedal, that could be have an auto mode. It wouldn't be that difficult, given modern control systems. This way you could work on your heel and toe technique on Saturday at the track and still make the rush hour slog into the office on monday without Having your clutch leg fall off.

Skylines also don't come in manual transmissions....Formula 1 cars either

No shit?

Add most Ferraris, Lambos and Porsches.

And IMO, it is a shame. Taking shifting away has taken a good bit of the human element out of F1 racing. It is now a battle of engineers.

[smackaholic]

The inline 6 has an advantage over the V-6. It is smoother running and cheaper to produce. Its length has been a problem to this point, but MB's new system eliminates all aux drive belts from the front of the engine making it considerably shorter. This allows it to fit in engine compartments a traditional I6 wouldn't fit in. Also, an I6 is way easier to work on. I hate working on V-6s in cramped engine bays.

[Dinsdale]

The Benz system eliminates the alternator and starter motor. In its place is a electric motor/generator. The AC is electric drive as is the power steering and water pump. This means no aux drive belts at all at the front of the engine.

WOW!!! THIS IS GROUNDBREAKING NEW TECHNOLOGY!!!!!! I guess I'm late to the party.

Sin,
1997 Prius




:facepalm:

[Dinsdale]

The Prius is a wonderful vehicle, albeit noisy. The Woman got a 2010 way cheap from her mom, and I've driven it hundreds of miles. For city driving, it's unbeatable. In very heavy traffic, it gets 45MPG. Very quick, up to about 445MPH, when the party end early.

The problem isn't the car, it's the people who buy them.

[FiatLux]

///

[FiatLux]

The Prius is a wonderful vehicle,

I stopped right there...

It's why I own one.



m2

[Dinsdale]

I stopped right there...

It's why I own one.

Well, let's start back up again, right here...

The problem isn't the car, it's the people who buy them.

[Mikey]

The Tesla Model S P100D will do 0-60 in 2.3 seconds.
The Model S P90D will do 2.8 sec, 2.6 in "Ludicrous speed."

[Kierland]

Because you can’t drive a car with a dented hood. You just a lying POC.

[Mikey]

The Tesla Model S P100D will do 0-60 in 2.3 seconds.
The Model S P90D will do 2.8 sec, 2.6 in "Ludicrous speed."

I had a Tesla, then a rock cracked the windshield and I was given a fix it ticket. For 4 months, Tesla could not get a replacement windshield so I traded it in. The dealership had it for 3 months and couldn't get a windshield. They had to wholesale it with 9500 miles on it over a rock ding in the windshield. My buddy is a DA in LA, he has a Tesla that had a dented hood and sat at the body shop for 8 months waiting for a new hood.

Horrible customer service and post sale support.

They still go fast.

The Hyundai Kona EV that I bought leased is, sort of, a competitor with the Model 3. Not quite as fast, not quite as high tech, lower MSRP. I didn't even consider a Model 3 for the reasons you mention. Plus Tesla has used up their $7,500 per vehicle federal tax credit, while Hyundai hasn't. The Kona EV shares a lot of parts with the conventional model so I don't expect the potential for parts shortages to be as high. Plus it gets better miles per kWh.

[smackaholic]

Being a Hyundai is not an issue these days, unless you’re a douche that worries what others think.

Buy the vehicle that suits YOU.

For me, it’s a VW Jetta TDI Sportwagen, 6 speed manual. Drives like an expensive German car. 43 mpg. Tons of room for work stuff.

If I had mostly city driving, I’d look real hard at a Prius or other Hybrid. Might even consider an EV, although I think they are not quite ready for prime time yet. They will be soon though.


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